A question about month names.
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  1. #1
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    A question about month names.

    why-is-ber-the-suffix-of-the-last-four-months-of-the-year

    September October November December

    And January February ending in uary

    Was there a person named ber or uary?

    So are April,May,June,July named after women?

    Where does it leave March? We heard of the Ids of March (Julius Caesar in Shakespeare novel). Origin of the name?
    August is alone, named after a male Roman. Perhaps should it be the 12th month?
    Leslie in Montreal

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    Re: A question about month names.


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    Re: A question about month names.

    Apparently, it's also raining in Montreal and Leslie has found some liquid nourishment to while away the hours.
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    Re: A question about month names.

    Quote Originally Posted by bob
    Apparently, it's also raining in Montreal and Leslie has found some liquid nourishment to while away the hours.
    BOB, you hit the nail on the head. Yes, it was raining and I was looking for something to enlighten the day for you. If you are home in your corner of the world, you share the same rain storm.
    Leslie in Montreal

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    Re: A question about month names.

    September October November - I only know that I mistake them all the time. Heck, even Slovaks inherited this scheme, but I just can't mistake it in Czech:
    Září - Říjen - Listopad.

    But what really bothers me with the US English are the numbers. Milión (million) is the same, no problem. But then you have billion. What billion? Billion is supposed to be Milliard.
    So then there is trillion, as in "bilión" or billion in the GB notion and to differentiate it from REAL trillion "trilión", you use the word "trilion"? Like trillion just with one "L"?
    Seriously, wtf?

    This is worse then the generally used US date format.

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    Re: A question about month names.

    Quote Originally Posted by lsatenstein
    why-is-ber-the-suffix-of-the-last-four-months-of-the-year

    September October November December

    And January February ending in uary

    Was there a person named ber or uary?

    So are April,May,June,July named after women?

    Where does it leave March? We heard of the Ids of March (Julius Caesar in Shakespeare novel). Origin of the name?
    August is alone, named after a male Roman. Perhaps should it be the 12th month?
    The following is based on a bit of web searching - definitely not to be relied upon:

    It would appear the "ber" suffix comes from the Latin month names which translate as "seventh month" ... "tenth month".
    January is also from Latin meaning the "month of Janus", and February from "month of purification".
    July is named in honour of Julius Caesar, August for Augustus Caesar.
    For the rest, you can look them up here: https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=may
    The words started out as Latin, got converted to old French, adopted by the English and then had their spelling adjusted to a more Latin form.

    Prior to Julius Caesar the Roman calendar only had ten months, starting from March. He added January and February which previously were days that were not in any month. (I sort of like the idea of having a few "spare" days in the calendar - could be useful.)

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    Re: A question about month names.

    Ah.. yeah, this is why geeks like us never get invited to parties...
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    Re: A question about month names.

    While time, and other units, can be a bit of a mess, I sometimes wonder what we will come up with in the future.

    Imagine a time in the future where we have colonised the solar system with bases on other planets, moons, and also various space stations that can be orbiting moons, planets, or the sun. Each of these will want their own local time that matches what is happening in their bit of sky.
    Then we have the interesting problem of trying to coordinate events between these bases where the speed of light and the varying distances between the bases will make life "interesting".

    I expect we will still have UTC and that somehow each base will have its own standard clock synched to the master on Earth.

    However, when some says "send me the report at 10:00 UTC" do they mean for it to be sent at that time or is it expected to be received at that time ??

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    Re: A question about month names.

    well, even in the far future the things will still be named for the latin gods,.

    Edited to remove sexual reference. - Bob

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    Re: A question about month names.

    So do we still keep the phrase "Coordinated Universal time?" when, as Ocratato mentions the universe where man has established themself(hes/shes) is more than planet earth?
    Leslie in Montreal

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    Re: A question about month names.

    Quote Originally Posted by lsatenstein
    So do we still keep the phrase "Coordinated Universal time?" when, as Ocratato mentions the universe where man has established themself(hes/shes) is more than planet earth?
    We would need some standard time, so UTC could continue to be used.
    However...
    If we assume that each base eventually adopts its own time system based on its own rotation rate (days) and the length of its years, then we are going to need something more complicated to facilitate communications between the bases.

    I would imagine something like the following displays:
    UTC
    Local time - using the local clock and calendar

    For each other base it would then have:
    Base name
    Local time in the other base's clock and calendar
    Plus two sets of times that account for the time it takes a message to travel the distance, one before and one after the present:
    +UTC, -UTC
    +Our local time, -Our local time (ie using our local time system)
    +Their local time, -Their local time (ie using the remote base's local time system)

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    Re: A question about month names.

    Quote Originally Posted by ocratato
    We would need some standard time, so UTC could continue to be used.
    However...
    If we assume that each base eventually adopts its own time system based on its own rotation rate (days) and the length of its years, then we are going to need something more complicated to facilitate communications between the bases.

    I would imagine something like the following displays:
    UTC
    Local time - using the local clock and calendar

    For each other base it would then have:
    Base name
    Local time in the other base's clock and calendar
    Plus two sets of times that account for the time it takes a message to travel the distance, one before and one after the present:
    +UTC, -UTC
    +Our local time, -Our local time (ie using our local time system)
    +Their local time, -Their local time (ie using the remote base's local time system)
    Hi Ocratato
    I was playing devil's advocate, using the words Coordinated Universal Time as Universal Time and Coordinated Universe Time are not the same. I wonder now, which universe would have the frame of reference if, hypothetically, it took 5.000005 milliseconds for a signal from that planet to reach ours, and 5.000006 seconds for our response signal to reach them. Perhaps we should just leave this discussion for the next generation.
    Last edited by lsatenstein; 4th September 2019 at 05:24 AM.
    Leslie in Montreal

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    Re: A question about month names.

    I agree that this is a fairly light hearted discussion - a bit of fun.

    While Einstein killed off the idea of Newtonian universal time, it still works OK for everyday use, and that includes most things at the solar system scale.
    [It is only when you get into high precision stuff like GPS does it become important. I seem to recall reading that NASA just uses Newtonian physics for their interplanetary course calculations.]

    In other words, a single frame of reference, such as UTC, would be fine when working within the solar system.
    [You could just transport an atomic clock to each base. It might need a slight adjustment to account for the speed during the trip.]

    Take an Earth - Mars example, using some rough numbers to get an "order of magnitude" estimate:
    A separation of 20 light-minutes and a relative speed of 24 Km/sec, gives us about 1/10 seconds of change in the message transit time during the time it takes for them message to make the trip. That is probably enough to need to be taken into account by our solar system wide time keeping system.

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