I am just about ready to give up

[Pluqueric]

I took a 6-week course through HP Learning Center; I downloaded the CD-ROM version of Fedora Core 4; For reasons I do not now remember, I was unable to install Fedora (some "fatal error" when "INSTALL" was clicked). I exchanged a few posts at this forum; nothing solved the problem. Eventually, I bought the SAMS Teach Yourself 700 page book on "Red Hat Fedora 4 Linux", which included a DVD with a full version of Fedora Core 4. When I ran the DVD, it, too, gave me a "fatal error" message and aborted the setup.

I let weeks pass while I continued to read evrything I could get my hands on. Yesterday, with a new harddrive, I tried again to install from the DVD. The same thing happened. I gave up. As much as I hate Microsoft, I guess I'm stuck with it. I am not stupid, but neither am I a Rocket Scientist, and although everything I read told me that the new Linux distros were User-Friendly and easy to use, etc. I looked around at all the printed material cluttering my desk and realized that THIS IS NOT WHAT I WOULD CALL USER-FRIENDLY!

I hated to abandon my investment (it might be "free", but it has already become very expensive!). A thought occurred to me, and I gave it "one last shot" -- I tried again to install from the four CD-ROMS. When it crossed the hurdle that had previously stopped me every time, I breathed a SIGH OF RELIEF. A half-an-hour later, during the installation of CD-ROM disk 3, the following error popped up on my monitor:

"There was an error installing libgtk-java-2.6.2-3. This can indicate media failure, lack of disk space, and/or hardware problems. This is a fatal error and your install will be aborted. Please verify your media and try your install again. Press the OK button to reboot your system."

Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? My new harddrive is 120 GBytes, I have no "hardware problems" with anything else on the computer, and I have no idea how to "verify my media".

I have complete installation disks for Linspire Linux, Red Hat Linux 7.1, and Mandrake 7.1; but everone tells me that Fedora is the best for personal home use. If I am unable to install Fedora, I guess I'll try Mandrake once more (a few years ago, I ran into similar problems when I tried to install Mandrake). I will foloow up with Red Hat, then as a last resort, I'll try Linspire. But my fascination with Linux has changed to disappointment and despair.

My apologies for being so wordy, but I've been led to believe that it is usually best to explain as much as possible. I will be truly grateful for any and all help.

P.S. I ran checks on the CDs and DVD before attempting to install. They all checked OK. and I reiterate that it was a new HD with nothing else on it.

[pparks1]

A "fatal error" message could apply to a piece of hardware other than your hard drive!

A thought occurred to me, and I gave it "one last shot" -- I tried again to install from the four CD-ROMS. When it crossed the hurdle that had previously stopped me every time, I breathed a SIGH OF RELIEF

What did you do to get further into the install?

and I have no idea how to "verify my media".

I ran checks on the CDs and DVD before attempting to install. They all checked OK

This means that you "verified the media"


I would initially suspect a driver problem, maybe with your IDE or SATA controller on your motherboard. It's possible that you might have to invoke a different install method based on your hardware configuration (text mode, vesa mode, etc).

Give us some more info and many will be very willing to help you out.

[skoona]

Installing Linux is user friendly if you have Linux compatible hardware! What is LCH? modern as in the last two years. If you hardware/pc is not modern then installing Linux the first time can be a real pain. Let's see if we can help you figure this out.

What kind of PC are you trying to install on?
Laptop/Desktop-Server?
Make and Model of CPU?
Graphics Card and Slot(PCI,AGP,MB)?
Graphics Card Memory Amount?
Number of Displays?
Disk Controller (PCI, SCSI, Serial...)
System Memory?
Motherboard model?
Mouse type (PCI, PS/2, Serial)
Optical Drive Type (DVD-ROM, DVD-RW, CD, CD-RW, DVD/CDRW...)?

Laptop: There are a few INITAL install line tips you will need to review. (first screen where you choose graphics or text install)
Desktop/Server: details, details, details, all based on your hardware and possibly your bios settings.
How do you want to partition your 120GB disk drive?

Answer the above and we can get started.

Note: I have tried several linux distributions and found fedora the easiest to manage and work with. However, Ubuntu was the easiest to install - just couldn't do much with it after it was installed.

[hatter]

Originally Posted by Pluqueric

"There was an error installing libgtk-java-2.6.2-3. This can indicate media failure, lack of disk space, and/or hardware problems. This is a fatal error and your install will be aborted. Please verify your media and try your install again. Press the OK button to reboot your system."

(and you said you checked the media too)

That's the typical message for a bad spot on the cd-disk. I've had a couple of upgrades/installs go bad because of it. Even though the cd-disk check diagnostic says it's all ok, there ends up being a bad spot that just won't read. And as you've found, the install croaks when it happens.

Two potential work arounds, one try burning(or obtaining through some method) a new disk. Or try to install without that package. Let's see. libgtk-java..... It's not a package I know and recognize (though that's not surprising), but from the looks of it, it's a Gnome tool kit library so that gnome apps can be written with Java(I could be wrong there, but it's a guess). So... If you install the KDE desktop instead of Gnome when you choose packages it may skip that package during the install and the bad spot on the cd-disk wouldn't keep you from at least getting a working box.

It's not a complete solution (esp if you really wanted gnome), but it might let you get something working. And before sinking another hour or so on my words, try to see exactly what depends upon that package(ie, for some reason does KDE require a GTK package).

good luck!

[rega451]

One thing you might also want to try is to run a live cd such as knoppix and see if your computer has any problems with it. Most computers should run knoppix without a problem I think. It's a good way to 'test run' your hardware. Knoppix isnt Fedora based, I think it's either Mandrake or Debian, but in any case it should give you an indication of any problems, especially if it is a hardware issue.

[Pluqueric]

Thank you for taking the time to help me. Each of you has given me things to try or to think about. As for describing the installation process, I’m not sure how much more I can add; but I’ll try. And as for specs about my P.C., I’ll cover that first.

The P.C. is one that I built, myself. I bought the motherboard and a desktop tower cabinet (350 Watt Power Supply), with see-through openings, in order to install fans with lights. I get a lot of compliments. But the important thing is that it WORKS, and in fact, works better than the Hewlett Packard Pavilion for which I paid $1150.

(I want to stress that I have had no problems with my personally-built P.C. A lot of people might want to question the integrity of the system since it is home-made; all I can say is, I took a lot of time building it, in order to be sure that everything was exactly as it should be. My first OS installation was Windows 98SE, and the only problems I’ve experienced have been from Windows 98’s constant crashes! I have a thermometer which, because of the numerous fans I installed, has never exceeded 89 degrees F. Believe me, if there were any problems to report, I would do so. I am more concerned with having a dependable P.C. than with any ego considerations.)

The motherboard is a Soyo P4X400 Dragon Ultra
CPU: Pentium4
RAM: 786 (512 + 256 = 768) Mbytes
OS: Windows 2000 SP3, build 5.0.2195.5201, with FAT32.
The Soyo has a built-in audio card, supports SPDIF 6 spkr system (installed), and uses
the C-Media CMI8738-MX chipset.
Graphics Card:
Graphics Card Memory Amount: 4Mb
Number of Displays:
Disk Controller:
Mouse Type: PS2 BTC M871 3-D Optical Mouse
Optical Drives: DVD+RW Toshiba ODD-DVD SD-R5272
CD-RW HL-DT-ST CD-RW GCE-8400B
Desired Partitioning of 120 Gb HDD: Three partitions:
1) 10 Gb for OS
2) 30 Gb for Programs, etc.
3) 60+Gb for personal documents

As for the graphics card, I can’t seem to locate my documentation – I know that the driver is a Matrox Mystique 220 PCI.

By number of displays, I again have no idea what that means. I have one 19” TFT monitor; I set it at 1024x768, but it is also capable of 1280x1024, 1280x720, 1152x864, 856x480, 800x600, 640x480. I do not use virtual desktops or applications that offer different aspects.

If any left-out info is critical or mandatory, I will make the effort to locate that info.

Back to the installation procedure. With only one exception, I chose defaults. When it came to selecting the packages to install, I picked “every one of them”, which I now realize involves a lot of programs! But I have a lot of experience code-writing in Visual Basic 6 and have been looking at Java and Python; so I wanted everything to be pre-installed and not have to go looking for things when the time came). I see now that I might want to go for a more minimalist installation – it might get me over the hurdle.

I did not attempt to partition the disk at this point. I forged the default, but whatever it is, I selected it.

With the DVD, as I mentioned in my first post, it simply would not proceed beyond the point wherein it was to begin file installation. When I decided to try the installation from the CD-ROMs, it was not based on anything concrete; I simply figured that the DVD came in a book, and the CDs were downloaded from the Internet. When it comes to computers, one never knows what tiny idiosyncrasy will make a difference.

The P.C. is now just about 22 months old (completed 11/2003).

Here, then, are my plans, while I wait for your observations and further input:

I will first of all try to install from the CD-ROMs, but with a highly selective set of software installations. Depending on how that goes, I might try a text mode install.

If that fails, I will insert my Linspire Linux DVD, which, like knoppix, can be run directly from the DVD without installation to the hard drive.

I will definitely select KDE instead of Gnome. I have no idea what the difference is, but it seems to me that Mandrake had KDE, and although I was never successful with that installation, either, the GUI looked comfortable. I selected Gnome only because it was the default with Fedora.

Finally, I will re-download the *.iso file for Disk #3 and burn a new CD.

So much help from so many people has given me renewed hope that I will someday be able to shake off the M$ leech. I will admit, however, there is a distinct learning curve involved before a person can be relatively comfortable with Linux. I use MS Office 2000 quite a lot, and although OpenOffice.org is touted as compatible, I imagine there are enough differences to keep a person busy for awhile.

Again, let me thank each of you. You guys are great.

Bob Boyd

[Pluqueric]

SSSSS UU UU CCCCC CCCCC EEEEEE SSSSS SSSSS !!!
SS SS UU UU CC CC CC CC EE EE SS SS SS SS !!!
SS UU UU CC CC EE SS SS !!!
SSSSS UU UU CC CC EEEE SSSSS SSSSS !!!
SS UU UU CC CC EE SS SS !!!
SS SS UU UU CC CC CC CC EE EE SS SS SS SS
SSSSS UUUUU CCCCC CCCCC EEEEEE SSSSS SSSSS !!!

(Just in case the above comes out looking like garbage, it says: SUCCESS!)

The only thing I did differently was to reduce the number of applications I selected for installation. Instead of selecting “Install Everything”, I went through the list carefully and selecting only those items I thought I would need or want right away.

I held my breath as it came up to Disk 3 (the one on which it failed, previously). But the progress bar had been more encouraging all along. Previously, it started out with “50 minutes remaining”; this time it started at 20 minutes. When it finally ejected disk 3 and asked for disk 4, I breathed a sigh of relief!

The rest went smoothly. When it rebooted and loaded the OS, I went exploring a little. I have a lot to learn, but that’s why I bought books and downloaded manuals.

Believe it or not, I could not find out how to shut down. “Logging Off” did absolutely nothing. I looked and looked, opened “HELP”, etc. As far as I can tell, nowhere does it tell you how to shut down.

For a while, I must keep Windows 2000; so I needed to shut down Fedora in order to reconnect this other hard drive. Come to think of it, when it booted, it didn’t give me a choice of OSes. I shall have to look into that.

My deep appreciation to everyone. No doubt you’ll hear from me in the not too distant future. Once again: you guys have been great. I’ll check back a little later for comments.

Bob Boyd

[mobsta]

That's what I like to hear, never give up.

As for shutting down go to Desktop dropdown menue and it should be last one there. If still no luck, just open up a terminal and type su then enter, it will ask for password(root password, admin password), this will log you in as admin, then type shutdown -h now and it will shutdown and turn the PC off.

to get you dual booting when you reconnect the Win2K HDD follow this magnificent tutorial

http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=975

Good luck M8

[Pluqueric]

Thank you, Mobsta. I’ll try what you say, provided I can figure out what a terminal is…

I hope everyone will check in, because I now have yet another unsolvable dilemma.

Before installing Fedora, I removed my other Hard Disk Drive (80 Gb), because I didn’t want anything to go wrong. Once everything was up and running, I shut down and put the 80Gb back into the PC (as Master, with the 120Gb – which contains Fedora – as slave).

Then I booted up and checked “My Computer” In addition to the three partitions on the 80Gb HDD (C:\, D:\, and E:\), it showed two optical drives (F:\ and G:\). It also showed two other drives (H:\ and I:\), which is how Fedora Install partitioned the 120Gb HDD -- /dev/had is a boot partition of only 102 Kb and /dev/hdb is VolGroup at 117138 Mb.

I got that information when Fedora was being installed; but when I right-clicked on either one of those drives in My Computer while running Windows 2000, it showed them empty (Space Used = 0%, Available = 0%).

What can this possibly tell me? Right now, with both HDDs installed, I cannot access Fedora. (I always seem to encounter problems that were never mentioned in books or FAQs. Or if they were covered, I somehow overlooked them. I really hate having to bother Tech Support people and having to post a question on one of these forums makes me feel like the village idiot!

But this is part of what I’m talking about when I say that, so far, Linux has not been very user-friendly for me.

Any ideas, anyone?

[mobsta]

Sorry, terminal is like the Command Prompt in windows. To get to it got to Applications dropdown menu and it should be in System Tools>Terminal.

As for the drives showing up empty in Win2K, since windows can't read the linux file systems it shows up as empty. There should be a way of removing the drives from My Computer using Control Panel>Administrative Tools>Computer Management>Disk Management.

To boot into Fedora change the boot order in your BIOS setup (Press the delete key during boot to get to BIOS setup or consult your M-board manual) and choose the Fedora HD to be the firs boot HD. If you encounter any problems then try connecting the Fedora disk as master and have the WIn2K disk as slave.

As for being the vilage idiot, that's nonsence. If you don't ask you will not learn. That's why this forum is here. In my country we have a saying, "Not knowing is not a shame, not asking is" I hope it makes sence.

Good luck.

[peter mosley]

I would like to echo the general sentiments of this thread: Linux (or at least Fedora - don't know about any others) is not as easy to install as its evangelists would have us believe.

This is not intended as a rant - my FC3 system is now up and running, albeit with some workarounds (eg always having to burn a cd as root user), and without the help of other posters in this forum I would not have got this far, so thanks folks. But applications whose Windows equivalents install out of the box do not do so in Fedora, and diagnostic messages are often unhelpful and/or incomprehensible. (eg it took me two weeks to figure out how to connect to the internet).

I think the open source software ideal is wonderful, and I have much respect for those guys who brought us a first rate operating system for free. Just please be a little more honest about the level of skill needed to install and maintain a system.

[Pluqueric]

Peter,

I look forward to using the many software applications supplied by Fedora, but you've made me a little nervous when it comes to connecting to the Internet. One of the big reasons for switching to a Linus distro is to escape from I.E.6 (a good enough browser, but like most M$ apps, it's too full of holes and too open to attack!). The biggest problem, now, is going to finding the time to devote to learning all the apps I want to try out. Even if the Linux Office apps are similar to Windows Office 2000, it still involves learning the ins and outs. For ex: I don't like the fonts supplied by Fedora; so I'm going to have to take the time to learn how to install new fonts, in addition to everything else.

And I'm so accustomed to Nero 6 for burning CDs; I use Acrobat 5.0 for creating pdf files; I use MS Paint inconjunction with Photo Editor to edit, touch up, or be creative with graphics, and as the application into which I place all my scanned items. There are so many little things I take for granted! While browsing through the apps on the menu in Fedora, I found I didn't even know where to begin with almost all of them.

And again, like you, I want to express my appreciation to everyone at this forum for being so helpful and taking so much of their own time to help others. I've heard that one of the great things about the Linux distros is that the users are quick and eager to lend support.

Long before Microsoft became the dominant force in OSes and software apps, I had studied PC DOS, Lotus 1-2-3, dBaseIII, WordPerfect, and a few other mostly-blue-and-white console type applications. Thus, learning Windows 3.1, then 95, and 98 came fairly easy. Over the years, Bill Gates and the Boyz made Windows truly user-friendly, mostly by the use of buttons and mouse clicks.

Linux distros need to take a lesson. A beginner should never have to use a Command Line, nor should a home user need to conern himself with networks and "Administrators". In order to install a Linux OS, the user should be able to have the OS do all of the work and make all of the decisions for the novice. There are, of course, certain questions which the user needs to answer: language, time zone, keyboard type -- but anything beyond that should be handled in such a way that the OS TELLS the user what it will do, and that if the user wants to change anything, he can always do so later (then a brief note directing the user to the method for changing things).

The maddening word of Alphabet Soup labels for everything from ASCII to KDE to HDD to JPG to I/O to SMTP to POP3 to BMPS to PW, et cetera ad infinitum is a huge deterrent for a lot of people. It's fine for experienced users, but my poor sister gets such a look of despair when confronted by these acronyms and doesn't even know where to begin to find out what they mean!

I wish there were a way to convey this to the rocket scientists who develop computer apps.

I am rambling on. Thanks again for your help and comments.

Bob Boyd

[Pluqueric]

Mobsta,

Thank you! You have really come through with a lot of very useful help and information. I almost overlooked your link to the tutorial for dual-booting. I'm going to go there as soon as I finish this.

I have no difficulties understanding your recommendations; so unless that tutorial become stoo involved and I am unable to set up dual-booting right away, I will do what you say about making changes in the BIOS.

By the way, what country are you in? In the States we have a similar saying, and one that is closely related: There are no stupid questions, just stupid answers. and - If you don't ask, you won't learn. As true as all of that may be, it is still difficult to shake off that "village idiot" feeling when everyone else seems to know so much more. Nonetheless, I am overcoming all of that and learning how to ask questions when I can't find the answers on my own.

Your reply to my post triggered yet another question. I hadn't really thought much about it -- I suppose I just assumed I could click and copy items from Fedora to Win2k and vice versa. Tell me, how does one copy a file from one OS to the other? Especially if Windows can't read Linux?

Some file types must be supported by different platforms (e.g: pdf, jpg, mp3, and so on), but if I've got some wav files in Win2K that I want to transfer to a Fedora app, how do I go about it? I don't mean for you to have to tutor me on this -- I'm just looking for a generality to give me something to go on.

I know I'll learn a lot as I go along, because I've got what seems to be some excellent books and manuals. I guess I am just dreading that long learning curve ahead of me.

Thanks again. I am very appreciative.

Bob Boyd

[mobsta]

Most people that dualboot Win and Linux use a FAT32 partition for shareing data between OS. That is the easiest option. As for finding the apps to do your work shouldn't be hard, just poke around the menues and you'll find the alternatives to many of the windows apps. There is Nero for Linux, the trial version can be found here http://www.nero.com/eng/nerolinux-prog.php?pak=12. As for working with graphics you can't go past GIMP. That's just few of the options we have in the Linux world.

One more link for you to explore which will answer most of your questions http://www.fedorafaq.org/.

Almost forgot to answer your question, I'm an armenian living in australia. I'm sure if you lived in or around LA you would've come across an armenian or two in your lifetime.

Good luck with your endevours.

[LaKing]

YES, .. if you select to install "everything" .. install fails. .. i remeber that i also had that.

Use a custom install, with the things you really need, them use yumex to get more software.

#root: yum install yumex

then add some repos, and then the apps.