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  #1  
Old 16th May 2005, 12:30 AM
c0uchm0nster Offline
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IMAP / dovecot for beginners?

Hi,

I've got dovecot / sendmail / spamassassin / squirrelmail running fine - amazingly more simple than the qmailrocks.org setup i used to run. However I'm very interested in learning more about IMAP to switch my clients over to it (currently backing up email requires every workstation to have file sharing enabled and their outlook files shared for nightly backup - i'd prefer all mail to be backed up from 1 machine - among other advantages of imap).

However I'm having a hell of a time finding information on the protocol / server. the documentation over at dovecot.org is more than lacking when it comes to anything after setup, and my searches haven't turned up enough for me to understand it.
So, mainly what I'm looking for is information on imap folders and deleting emails.

I know how to create new folders for a users account, however I can't figure out how to take advantage of them. In Outlook 2003, if I delete an email it crosses out but remains in the inbox folder. If I use the move to folder command it copies it to the folder, but also remains in the Inbox.
So, question 1: Is there any way to make either Outlook or dovecot automatically move any deleted email to another folder?

question 2: I've read about procmail filters that have spamassassin send spam emails to different mbox mailboxes. For maildir boxes is this as simple as adding a trailing / on the path of that return filter? Is it even possible to have spamassassin/procmail move emails to another Maildir directory (other than the DEFAULT).


if anyone can specifically answer these questions it'd be great, but I'm also interested in finding some good (preferrably websites versus retail books) information on how imap servers generally work (how they store emails and how programs can interact with this).



oh, one more thing. I noticed if I delete the email in Outlook it stays there just crossed out forever. But if I log into an account with those crossed out emails using Squirrelmail they disappear from squirrelmail and outlook (like they've finally been permanently deleted instead of just crossed out like outlook does) - if possible i'd like to have both programs just put deleted emails into a trash folder, and then let the user go into that trash folder if they want to permanently delete the emails (like a pop service in outlook - first delete goes to trash folder, delete fromt trash and its gone)


thanks in advance
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  #2  
Old 16th May 2005, 01:11 AM
gavinw6662 Offline
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Mozilla's thunderbird puts the e-mails in the trash folder, any reason not to use this???
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  #3  
Old 16th May 2005, 02:14 AM
c0uchm0nster Offline
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I've already started switching some client offices over to thunderbird/firefox, however other offices can't /won't stop using outlook - some have exchange servers in addition to sendmail/dovecot or qmail servers and some use company calendar features etc.

Glad to hear thunderbird works well though - I hadn't had a chance to test it out yet.
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  #4  
Old 16th May 2005, 05:45 PM
c0uchm0nster Offline
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Anyone have any ideas? I can't believe no one's come across this problem.
It's the dovecot standard install/config that comes with FC3 - only chages are adding all 4 pop/imap protocols.
It's Outlook 2003 from a W2k3 Small Business Server deployment.

Thanks again
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  #5  
Old 18th May 2005, 05:47 PM
predisposition Offline
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Hi,

Note that Outlook does not support IMAP very well... It's an amazing weekness. Anyway, the problem you are describing has nothing to do with the server and everything to do with Outlook. What I did was just train my users to get used to the line through the message. Then, to totally deleted it just do Edit-->Purge Deleted Messages. Then they disappear. When you "move" a message Outlook is 1) deleting it from the old location (hence the strikethrough) and 2) copying it to the new location... Again, just do Edit-->Purge to clear it up. If that's not acceptible you can probably create a rule to do it automatically, but I haven't bothered to do that... Have you tried creating a rule?

In terms of general IMAP info... all imap really provides is a different way for users to access emails. The way you have your server set up doesn't change -- you can use mbox or maildir, you can switch between pop and imap, etc... all imap is is a way to check your email. I recommend using postfix+courier-imap+amavisd-new+spamassassin+clamav for a really solid, easy set up.


hth
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  #6  
Old 18th May 2005, 06:16 PM
c0uchm0nster Offline
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I have checked out rules - unfortunately there's no way to include "deleted" status in any rule - custom or otherwise, so that seem's like it would be fairly hard to implement.

Anyways, thanks for the reply - a big relief that it's not the server cuasing the problem (even if it means I'm going to have a hard time getting by the problem ).

Thanks again for the reply - and welcome to the forum.
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  #7  
Old 19th May 2005, 04:57 AM
gavinw6662 Offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by predisposition
Hi,

Note that Outlook does not support IMAP very well... It's an amazing weekness. Anyway, the problem you are describing has nothing to do with the server and everything to do with Outlook. What I did was just train my users to get used to the line through the message. Then, to totally deleted it just do Edit-->Purge Deleted Messages. Then they disappear. When you "move" a message Outlook is 1) deleting it from the old location (hence the strikethrough) and 2) copying it to the new location... Again, just do Edit-->Purge to clear it up. If that's not acceptible you can probably create a rule to do it automatically, but I haven't bothered to do that... Have you tried creating a rule?

In terms of general IMAP info... all imap really provides is a different way for users to access emails. The way you have your server set up doesn't change -- you can use mbox or maildir, you can switch between pop and imap, etc... all imap is is a way to check your email. I recommend using postfix+courier-imap+amavisd-new+spamassassin+clamav for a really solid, easy set up.


hth
On the contrary, Oulook is suppose to have excellent imap usage with, and only with and Exchange server (atleast that is the info floating around my office, and the web). How nice of microsoft, make a product that only works well, with another piece of MicroCrap. Ha ha ha. The purge button does work, and is the answer. But do remember, a handy dandy option in outlook is to hide the purged files (View > Arrange by > current view > Hide Messages marked for deletion). Then you just need to remind your users to purge on a weekly basis, as that save mail will add up.

I looked in Outlook 2k3 about creating a rule to "move deleted items" but it isn't there. I think that is another added functionality of running an Exchange server (as I have been told by the people at work, no experience, but will soon when they finally migrate us).
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  #8  
Old 19th May 2005, 12:48 PM
predisposition Offline
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Good point gavinw6662! It's true, Outlook works great with and only with Exchange server. And not just email, calendar functions as well... Shame on our office I guess for being tied to Outlook... I've been trying to get people to switch to OOO and Mozilla products, but it's definitely an uphill battle for typical windows users.
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