First time user

[brisray]

This is my first installation of any Linux OS and so some of the following problems may well be something to do with me rather than FC4.

First install 2.6.11-1.1226_FC4 (CDs), current install 2.6.11-1.1287_FC4 (yum updates)

My initial install was from CDs 2.6.11-1.1226_FC4 - the screen that asks for the keyboard language doesn't show the back / forward buttons until the mouse is moved over where they should be (bottom right of screen) - just a little niggle, but I was getting worried for a few minutes as nothing was happening.

On boot up - all versions up to and including 2.6.11-1.1287_FC4 - the router discovery comes up as having failed. Ive manually set the IP address on the PC, my router is a Belkin Wireless G, the PC is connected to that through CAT5 cable.

On boot up - all versions up to and including 2.6.11-1.1287_FC4 - CLVMD fails. What is this? Is this important?

I can't get any audio out of the computer. The audio card is detected as an ESS Technology ES1978 Maestro 2E, Module snd-es 1968 (from Gnome, Desktop > System Settings > Soundcard Detection)

Up2Date hasn't worked properly from the first install, whether or not I install the GPC key. The Progress Dialog for the installed RPM packages comes up, then stalls - no progress even after leaving it running all night.

I'm now using Yum to do the downloads and installs. From the first installation I can't use "yum -y update" from the console because it complains that "Error: Missing Depenency: struts11 = 1.1-jpp_2fc is needed by package struts11-webapps-tomcat5" so I use "yum -y --exclude=struts11 update"

This machine is going to be a web server to replace a Windows 2000 and Apache 2 PC so I may well need tomcat in the future.

That's about all for now. No doubt there will be other things I won't know how to do.

Ray

[jtang613]

FC4 is currently in the testing phase. This release is intended only for test and bug fix. The stable release is not due until June 6.

Since this is your first Linux install of any kind, I *highly* recommend installing FC3 instead. You will most certainly encounter far fewer (if any) problems.

Download the FC3 install CDs or DVD, install, then update. If you are still having trouble, lets us know.

Jason

[brisray]

If these are FC4 bugs/problems shouldn't they be reported and fixed before the final release?

Ray

[jtang613]

Yes, they should, will, and probably already have been. However, the *stable* release still won't be available until June 6th. Until then, if you want a *usable* system, use FC3.

Jason

[brisray]

I really don't mind what OS I use. If FC4 turns out to be too buggy I'll just take the drive back out and put the old Windows one back in.

I was and am curious if anyone here was having the same problems, and if so, are there fixes for them that I've missed? This was a complete install on a freshly formatted drive. The machine has been running fine for a couple of years and I've been using it as a web server for one of those - so there should be no hardware problems. Some of the things I mentioned are already known problems - http://www.archivum.info/fedora-test.../msg01425.html and so on but I couldn't find anything else about them, other than there is a problem.

I know it's development software, I was just surprised to see things like the struts error and the OS identifying the sound card then refusing to use it when all the files from the CD and updates have been loaded.

The router discovery failure on boot-up is also confusing. Even if it can't find the router, it certainly has no problem connecting to the internet - updates work fine through yum, all the installed web browsers work, VNC works to other computers on my network, email works ok, even Apache works fine - http://brisray.com is actually hosted on the machine. Or is what Linux calls a router different to what I'm thinking of?

The CLVMD problem is also curious, all I've been able to find out about it is that it's something to do with clustering, but nothing about why its failing.


Ray

[RUSTY]

Originally Posted by brisray

I really don't mind what OS I use. If FC4 turns out to be too buggy I'll just take the drive back out and put the old Windows one back in.

I was and am curious if anyone here was having the same problems, and if so, are there fixes for them that I've missed? This was a complete install on a freshly formatted drive. The machine has been running fine for a couple of years and I've been using it as a web server for one of those - so there should be no hardware problems. Some of the things I mentioned are already known problems - http://www.archivum.info/fedora-test.../msg01425.html and so on but I couldn't find anything else about them, other than there is a problem.

I know it's development software, I was just surprised to see things like the struts error and the OS identifying the sound card then refusing to use it when all the files from the CD and updates have been loaded.

The router discovery failure on boot-up is also confusing. Even if it can't find the router, it certainly has no problem connecting to the internet - updates work fine through yum, all the installed web browsers work, VNC works to other computers on my network, email works ok, even Apache works fine - http://brisray.com is actually hosted on the machine. Or is what Linux calls a router different to what I'm thinking of?

The CLVMD problem is also curious, all I've been able to find out about it is that it's something to do with clustering, but nothing about why its failing.


Ray

I have exactly the same problems but here's what I did for "router discovery and clvmd" open shell / console and type chkconfig --list (this will show you all the services running on) then for Router Discovery
you can do next chkconfig --list rdisc (this will show all that service with all the all the levels it's running on and off) then you can chkconfig --level 23456 rdisc off (this will shut it down comletely)
for clvmd which is antivirus daemon you can do the same,, to be short chkconfig --level 345 clvmd off
What about the struts11 is I don't know the work around yet. All I know you can do the other updates still.
yum -y update a* (updates all components that start from letter anaconda for instance)

[brisray]

Thanks for that. I had to look up what the run level numbers meant (lots of sites for people new to Linux for info like that), but I understand what you're telling me to do.

Ray

[markkuk]

Originally Posted by brisray

I know it's development software, I was just surprised to see things like the struts error and the OS identifying the sound card then refusing to use it when all the files from the CD and updates have been loaded.

Fedora Test versions can have any kinds of serious errors, you shouldn't be surprised if your computer collapses into a black hole and destroys everything surrounding it.

Originally Posted by brisray

The router discovery failure on boot-up is also confusing.

In normal home/office networks, the router (a.k.a the default gateway) is defined either through DHCP or by manual network configuration and the router discovery protocol isn't needed. SOHO routers don't support dynamic router discovery anyway.

[jtang613]

Originally Posted by brisray

I really don't mind what OS I use. If FC4 turns out to be too buggy I'll just take the drive back out and put the old Windows one back in.

I understand you are curious about these issues. And there probably are fixes for many of them.

However, the point I was trying to make is that this is a TEST release of Fedora Core 4 and is not meant to be installed by the general population yet. You may have noticed that the release name is Fedora Core 4 - Test 2. Leading up to each production release are a series of three alpha releases. The purpose of these releases is for testing and reporting bugs - only. Do not expect any sort of usable system from a test release.

This is NOT FC4, this is FC4t2. Unless you are an experienced Fedora / Redhat user interested in testing a pre-production release to help work out the bugs, this is not the version for you. FC3 has been around for a few months and most components have updates available through up2date or yum. Once updated, FC3 is very stable and usable. I've been around here for a while, and I'd estamate that approximately 80% - 85% of FedoraForum.org is using FC3.

Now, you've already stated that this is your first Linux experience of any kind. I'd like it to be a positive one for you. But by installing an Alpha release, instead of the Stable release, you are asking for all sorts of headaches that really aren't necessary. And just because you installed the wrong version doesn't mean you should give up on Fedora and switch back to Windows, it just means you need to install the correct version in order to avoid the problems you are experiencing.

In the event you do run into one or two hiccups with FC3, chances are that it will have a fix already defined and you will have the entire forum to turn to for support instead of one group.

m2c,
Jason

[brisray]

Hi Jason, it's OK, I know what you're telling me. I'm not expecting the version of Linux I've installed to run perfectly, and I'm not going to start shouting and moaning if the whole thing crashes.

The experience with this IS a positive one for me. The problems I'm experiencing seem to be the same ones that every one is experiencing with this OS. Things I don't know about Linux appear to be easily found elsewhere on the web - rather than me clutter up this forum with newbie questions about it - like the run levels I mentioned before.

There is one point I'd like to make. As a complete beginner with Linux of any type wouldn't that make me even more qualified to use a test version of the OS?

Ray

[jtang613]

Originally Posted by brisray

There is one point I'd like to make. As a complete beginner with Linux of any type wouldn't that make me even more qualified to use a test version of the OS?

You like a challenge, hey, I can respect that. Qualified? That's probably a bit of an overstatement. You're likely referring to testing user-friendliness and such, but those areas contain only minimal (if any) changes from version to version. Experience plays a big role in recognizing bugs and being able to classify them and their root causes.

I was under the impression you wanted a Linux system to use on your server. If that's still the case, I don't think anyone here would recommend a test version. FC4t3 will be released tomorrow, and the final FC4 release is less than a month from today. Both will have significant bug fixes over the previous versions - the final release being (mostly) rock-solid. So all of these FC4t2 issues will be irrelevant tomorrow - and support for FC4t3 will cease completely in less than 30 days.

I tried...
Jason

[brisray]

You certainly have tried, a lesser man than I would have slunk off in shame after the first post. I'm not exactly flying through Linux yet, but I'm certainly doing a lot of reading and experimenting.

The server part is going very well. Apache and Webalizer were probably easier for me to set up than when I first started using them on Windows. I'm even getting used to using the command line again - I mostly stopped using that years ago when programs like Gem and Windows came along. VNC between Windows and Linux works wonderfully, and vsftpd should be running later today with a bit of luck - if not I'll try one of the GUI ones.

The only thing I'm disappointed in is the lack of drivers for hardware devices, but that seems to be an issue about Linux as a whole, not just this test version. I've got several scanners and such here, none of which seem to be supported by SANE.

You warned me about this being a test version, but for what I'm using it for at the moment it works very well. As I understand it, FC5 will be out at the end of the year, so perhaps we'll be swapping posts like this again then.

Ray

[bit.shaker]

You warned me about this being a test version, but for what I'm using it for at the moment it works very well. As I understand it, FC5 will be out at the end of the year, so perhaps we'll be swapping posts like this again then.

Hi Brisray,

you made me register on fedoraforum to post in this thread . At first I thought you were misunderstanding the term "test" as (falsely assumed) "check this cool stuff out", and not as (like it is meant) "use on your own risk - there ARE bugs" . Maybe I read too many of linux newcomer's posts asking questions about various things not working (or different from OS xy ) and at the same time using development releases that hadn't reached beta status yet. I'm trying to convince myself now that you know what you're doing. As a matter of fact, I even think you understand that the OS your using right now is not considered suitable for a production system (server).

I simply want to urge you to install a stable and supported distribution (e.g. FC3) if you want to do more then just to toy around. It's like driving too fast knowing that the brakes are not working. If you insist on doing, don't provoke loss of important data and make regular backups. Also, soon there will be no more updates (security, feature, bugfix, whatever.) for FC4 Test 2. You'll know when, when up2date tells you that there are no new packages/upgrades for more than five to six days .

Besides that, tinkering with Linux is fun, so you should keep at it ... and, may the learning curve be with you ... always.

[brisray]

I've been using computers for a long time (my first was an 8086 running MSDOS 2.8 - the same machine is now turning up in computing museums!). I've been toying around with the idea of trying out Linux for a while but a friend of mine finally persuaded me to give it a go.

I run a mixed Windows / Mac network at home and learning a new operating system isn't too bad - but it's been a long time since I used a command line except to run a few batch files and those hard to get at Windows settings though.

The thought of using a brand new version of Linux appealed to me as I've always found the best way to learn how these things work is by seeing what can go wrong with them. If you've ever used Windows v2 let alone 3.11 you'll know exactly what I mean.

I laughed my socks off when I was going through some of the commands and typed mc in terminal. It looks almost exactly like XTree - an old DOS file manager that must be 20 years old if it's a day, and vi reminds me so much of edlin I nearly broke out in a cold sweat. Edlin was a line editor for DOS and probably one of the hardest to use text editors for any operating system ever produced - oddly enough it's in all versions of Windows, including XP, but you'd have to be mad - or desperate - to use it.

XTtee - historic fan site - http://www.xtreefanpage.org/

Ray