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  #31  
Old 20th March 2012, 02:35 PM
bob Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Terry, consider that the ISP connection's in your name and you've agreed to a contract, part of which is saying that you won't do anything illegal with it. Therefore, it's YOUR responsibility to monitor it and anyone who uses it.

Of course, if it's a WIFI router involved and some kids were war-driving and downloading off an unsecured or weak-password-protected WIFI, you might try to make a defense for that. Good luck, though, since you're still responsible for what happens on your connection.
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  #32  
Old 20th March 2012, 02:41 PM
DBelton Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

And have you noticed that a lot of the routers that the ISP's give you with your service have wifi enabled and unsecured?

First thing I do is to disable the wifi, then open up the router and remove the antenna. (Can't even get a router from my ISP that isn't wifi )
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  #33  
Old 20th March 2012, 02:57 PM
pete_1967 Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBelton View Post
First thing I do is to disable the wifi, then open up the router and remove the antenna. (Can't even get a router from my ISP that isn't wifi )
First thing I do with mine is factory reset and then I sell them
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Last edited by pete_1967; 20th March 2012 at 02:59 PM.
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  #34  
Old 20th March 2012, 04:03 PM
BBQdave Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBelton View Post
And have you noticed that a lot of the routers that the ISP's give you with your service have wifi enabled and unsecured?

First thing I do is to disable the wifi, then open up the router and remove the antenna. (Can't even get a router from my ISP that isn't wifi )
I must be out of pace with current services by ISP's. All I have ever used is internet service from any given provider, and I have had 5 different ISP's in my history of internet use.
The only hardware provided was modems with single ethernet connection. I set up my own network (with my own hardware).

So ISP's are now using modem-router combination hardware or is that a package deal they are selling?
No thanks on a wifi router from an ISP
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Last edited by BBQdave; 20th March 2012 at 04:09 PM. Reason: adjusted number up for ISP's
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  #35  
Old 20th March 2012, 06:30 PM
beaker_ Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pete_1967 View Post
Can I some of what ever it is you are smoking?
Seams to me there is plenty going around.
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  #36  
Old 20th March 2012, 07:05 PM
pete_1967 Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by beaker_ View Post
Seams to me there is plenty going around.
Just stop smoking that stuff and you'll find out that there isn't.

And my ignore list just grew by 1.
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  #37  
Old 20th March 2012, 07:18 PM
beaker_ Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pete_1967 View Post
Just stop smoking that stuff and you'll find out that there isn't.

And my ignore list just grew by 1.
And have yourself a nice day.
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  #38  
Old 20th March 2012, 08:18 PM
sillav Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Problem solved:

http://www.prq.se/?p=tunnel&intl=1
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  #39  
Old 20th March 2012, 08:30 PM
pete_1967 Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by sillav View Post
Or Tor or any other anonymity network Thing is, the ones "pirating" in great quantities mostly use something like that already. It's those who may download couple files that will get hit, as usual. And dead grandmothers:
Quote:
^ "I sue dead people". Ars Technica. February 4, 2005 : http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20050204-4587.html
^ "Grandmother piracy lawsuit dropped". BBC News. September 26, 2003. Retrieved 2007-04-03. : http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertain...ic/3140160.stm
^ Bylund, Anders (April 24, 2006). "RIAA sues computer-less family". Ars Technica. : http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20060424-6662.html
^ a b "RIAA settles with 12-year-old girl", CNET News, September 2003 : http://news.com.com/RIAA+settles+wit...3-5073717.html
Plenty more on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade_...ing#References for example.
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  #40  
Old 20th March 2012, 08:46 PM
sillav Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by pete_1967 View Post
Or Tor or any other anonymity network Thing is, the ones "pirating" in great quantities mostly use something like that already. It's those who may download couple files that will get hit, as usual. And dead grandmothers:


Plenty more on https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trade_...ing#References for example.
I see it as being somewhat different.

TOR is a free service, and the experience is such that you are not getting your monies worth from your ISP. It's primary purpose would be anonymity, not privacy. And it doesn't seem to increase security either, since anything transmitted in clear text can be read by every hop in the chain, including your ISP, or so I understand it.

The dedicated VPN is a paid service, with much better speeds, hence better value and web experience. It's not anonymous because if you violate the laws of Sweden then your subscriber information can be provided to law enforcement. It's primary purpose is privacy not anonymity. Security is also better, since there are few hops to the destination ip, and you know exactly where those hops land (the server offering the VPN service and no one else).

If any of this is wrong I'd be happy to be corrected. It's become of recent interest to me given Canada's recent moves to allow warrant-less access to ISP records as well as the subject of this thread, ISP's becoming copyright enforcers.
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  #41  
Old 20th March 2012, 10:13 PM
pete_1967 Offline
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linuxfirefox
Re: ISPs as copyright cops

There's one hop between you and the destination and that is most probably located in the same country you live in if you use VPN provider. There can be any number of hops between you and destination, located anywhere in the world, if you use anonymous networks.

In both cases you tunnel you traffic through encrypted channel (e.g. https with Tor), which one you think is easier to crack? That company doing business or the exit node in say China with no knowledge what so ever of the originating IP#, or way to trace it either?

Neither really is perfect solution, but if I were to try to hide my illegal download activities, I'd go for anonymous network and day and twice on Sundays. Even if my traffic was unencrypted, being anonymous would be better than ability to encrypt my payload since it's not hard to figure out what that 560Mb encrypted file from PirateBay contains

For reliable secure tunnels, VPNs are better choice although you can configure Tor for example, to use X amount of proxies in Y countries, there's no guarantee of the speed or that the nodes you selected exist an hour later.
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  #42  
Old 20th March 2012, 10:47 PM
kona0197 Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Sorry there are just too mamny varibles to enforce the policing of the internet.

Such as:

Who was really behind the computer when the piracy occurred?
Was the user's account on said computer hacked?
Was someone else's account used instead of the owner?
Was the owner even home?
Was the router unsecured?

Besides if I could prove that I had nothing to do with what happened I'm sure i would be off the hook...
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  #43  
Old 20th March 2012, 11:36 PM
bob Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Terry, there's idiocy afoot: http://brainz.org/14-most-ridiculous...riaa-and-mpaa/

So, even if it never goes to trial, think of the cash you'd have to outlay for a decent attorney!
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  #44  
Old 20th March 2012, 11:57 PM
kona0197 Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Interesting article, thank you.

EDIT: Found this in the article:

Quote:
The judge in this case had decided that simply paying for internet access that someone else uses to download files does not make a person entirely liable for those downloads.
So if someone downloads off my connection perhaps the Judge will say the same thing?
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Last edited by kona0197; 21st March 2012 at 12:30 AM.
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  #45  
Old 21st March 2012, 06:14 AM
BBQdave Offline
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Re: ISPs as copyright cops

Quote:
Originally Posted by kona0197 View Post
So if someone downloads off my connection perhaps the Judge will say the same thing?
Yeah, good luck with consistent judgements and the miaa. The miaa has way more money (and thus influence) to affect the courts and government than us average folk.

Again though, the more the miaa and other corporate clowns try to control and lock down the web, the less relevant they become. The web is not a commodity or resource to be hoarded and exploited as a consumable product. The web is communication, exploration, knowledge sharing. Even with the consumables (music, video) people (consumers) are participating and evolving the mediums. With the miaa left standing with their mouths open desperately grabbing for some control (and profit) over this exchange on the web.

The most effective (and painful) way to deal with greedy corporations, is to ignore them. Do not buy their product. Directly support the source (the artists) they exploit, and cut out the greedy middle parasite (miaa).

After the economy tanked, my family and I made a proactive choice to support local companies and products, and purchase (unbranded) products from the source when ever possible. I believe this is happening a lot everywhere, as people are unplugging from corporate consumables. Which I think is causing the desperate power grab by the likes of miaa and other out of touch greedy corporations. People just don't care to play their game anymore.

OK, I have to go now and hug a tree
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