 |
 |
 |
 |
| Using Fedora General support for current versions. Ask questions about Fedora and it's software that do not belong in any other forum. |

13th December 2011, 11:51 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamW
well, AFAICT, nothing is lying to you. gnome-session-check-accelerated fails because it thinks there's no hardware 3D acceleration, and indeed there *is* none, according to glxinfo:
OpenGL vendor string: VMware, Inc.
OpenGL renderer string: Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe
OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.11
that right there is software rendering (llvmpipe is the modern software 3D system). It seems from this that the system in question is a VMware VM, so I'd guess that you somehow had working 3D passthrough in VMWare prior to the update but not after?
|
Just finished upgrading to F16 on my Dell E6400 with GM45 Intel onboard (working in F15 GNOME3 without an issue) and am apparently stuck in this same issue; note that:
- I'm running the same 3.2.0-rc5 kernel that works fine with F15 (rebuilt with native F16 GCC of course, as I need to compile the broadcom_sta out-of-tree wireless driver)
- my X session starts from the console prompt (I don't do GDM)
If I run glxgears -info, that says
[asuardi@duff log]$ glxgears -info
GL_RENDERER = Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe
GL_VERSION = 2.1 Mesa 7.11.2
GL_VENDOR = VMware, Inc.
...whereas from my Xorg.0.log I have
Code:
[ 3373.197] (II) intel: Driver for Intel Integrated Graphics Chipsets: i810,
i810-dc100, i810e, i815, i830M, 845G, 854, 852GM/855GM, 865G, 915G,
E7221 (i915), 915GM, 945G, 945GM, 945GME, Pineview GM, Pineview G,
965G, G35, 965Q, 946GZ, 965GM, 965GME/GLE, G33, Q35, Q33, GM45,
4 Series, G45/G43, Q45/Q43, G41, B43, B43, Clarkdale, Arrandale,
Sandybridge Desktop (GT1), Sandybridge Desktop (GT2),
Sandybridge Desktop (GT2+), Sandybridge Mobile (GT1),
Sandybridge Mobile (GT2), Sandybridge Mobile (GT2+),
Sandybridge Server, Ivybridge Mobile (GT1), Ivybridge Mobile (GT2),
Ivybridge Desktop (GT1), Ivybridge Desktop (GT2), Ivybridge Server
[ 3373.197] (II) VESA: driver for VESA chipsets: vesa
[ 3373.197] (II) FBDEV: driver for framebuffer: fbdev[ 3373.197] (--) using VT number 4
[ 3373.206] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/drivers/intel_drv.so
[ 3373.206] (WW) Falling back to old probe method for vesa
[ 3373.206] (WW) Falling back to old probe method for fbdev
[ 3373.206] (II) Loading sub module "fbdevhw"
[ 3373.206] (II) LoadModule: "fbdevhw"
[ 3373.206] (II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/libfbdevhw.so
[ 3373.206] (II) Module fbdevhw: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
[ 3373.206] compiled for 1.11.2, module version = 0.0.2
[ 3373.206] ABI class: X.Org Video Driver, version 11.0
[ 3373.206] drmOpenDevice: node name is /dev/dri/card0
[ 3373.206] drmOpenDevice: open result is 10, (OK)
[ 3373.206] drmOpenByBusid: Searching for BusID pci:0000:00:02.0
[ 3373.206] drmOpenDevice: node name is /dev/dri/card0
[ 3373.206] drmOpenDevice: open result is 10, (OK)
[ 3373.206] drmOpenByBusid: drmOpenMinor returns 10
[ 3373.206] drmOpenByBusid: drmGetBusid reports pci:0000:00:02.0
[ 3373.206] (II) intel(0): Creating default Display subsection in Screen section
"Default Screen Section" for depth/fbbpp 24/32
[ 3373.206] (==) intel(0): Depth 24, (--) framebuffer bpp 32
[ 3373.206] (==) intel(0): RGB weight 888
[ 3373.206] (==) intel(0): Default visual is TrueColor
[ 3373.206] (II) intel(0): Integrated Graphics Chipset: Intel(R) GM45
[ 3373.207] (--) intel(0): Chipset: "GM45"
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): Relaxed fencing enabled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): Wait on SwapBuffers? enabled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): Triple buffering? enabled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): Framebuffer tiled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): Pixmaps tiled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): 3D buffers tiled
[ 3373.207] (**) intel(0): SwapBuffers wait enabled
<...>
[ 3373.848] (II) UnloadModule: "vesa"
[ 3373.848] (II) Unloading vesa
[ 3373.848] (II) UnloadModule: "fbdev"
[ 3373.848] (II) Unloading fbdev
[ 3373.848] (II) UnloadModule: "fbdevhw"
[ 3373.848] (II) Unloading fbdevhw
[ 3373.848] (==) Depth 24 pixmap format is 32 bpp
[ 3373.848] (II) intel(0): [DRI2] Setup complete
[ 3373.848] (II) intel(0): [DRI2] DRI driver: i965
[ 3373.848] (II) intel(0): Allocated new frame buffer 1472x900 stride 6144, tiled
[ 3373.860] (II) UXA(0): Driver registered support for the following operations:
[ 3373.860] (II) solid
[ 3373.860] (II) copy
[ 3373.860] (II) composite (RENDER acceleration)
[ 3373.860] (II) put_image
[ 3373.860] (II) get_image
[ 3373.860] (==) intel(0): Backing store disabled
[ 3373.860] (==) intel(0): Silken mouse enabled
[ 3373.860] (II) intel(0): Initializing HW Cursor
[ 3373.872] (II) intel(0): RandR 1.2 enabled, ignore the following RandR disabled message.
[ 3373.880] (==) intel(0): DPMS enabled
[ 3373.880] (==) intel(0): Intel XvMC decoder enabled
[ 3373.880] (II) intel(0): Set up textured video
[ 3373.880] (II) intel(0): [XvMC] xvmc_vld driver initialized.
[ 3373.880] (II) intel(0): direct rendering: DRI2 Enabled
[ 3373.880] (==) intel(0): hotplug detection: "enabled"
[ 3373.881] (--) RandR disabled
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension Generic Event Extension
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension SHAPE
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension MIT-SHM
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XInputExtension
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XTEST
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension BIG-REQUESTS
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension SYNC
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XKEYBOARD
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XC-MISC
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XINERAMA
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension XFIXES
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension RENDER
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension RANDR
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension COMPOSITE
[ 3373.881] (II) Initializing built-in extension DAMAGE
[ 3373.882] (II) SELinux: Disabled by boolean
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_MESA_copy_sub_buffer
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_INTEL_swap_event
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_SGI_swap_control and GLX_MESA_swap_control
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_SGI_make_current_read
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap backed by buffer objects
[ 3373.889] (II) AIGLX: Loaded and initialized i965
[ 3373.889] (II) GLX: Initialized DRI2 GL provider for screen 0
So I'm pretty puzzled about the seeming inconsistency between the glxgears output plus messages such as:
gnome-session-is-accelerated: No hardware 3D support.
gnome-session-check-accelerated: Helper exited with code 256
and the Xorg log messages.
Summarizing, I ran a fresh install, rebooted into 3.1.0-F16 kernel (which did start), built custom kernel (from existing and working .config under F15) to support Broadcom wireless driver, rebooted into custom kernel, brought up wireless link, ran yum update, startx ---> no GNOME3 support.
---------- Post added at 12:51 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:44 AM ----------
...and this is glxgears -info from F15 (yes, I dual-boot and zap my oldest partition - which was F14 until today):
[asuardi@duff ~]$ glxgears -info
Running synchronized to the vertical refresh. The framerate should be
approximately the same as the monitor refresh rate.
GL_RENDERER = Mesa DRI Mobile Intel® GM45 Express Chipset
GL_VERSION = 2.1 Mesa 7.11
GL_VENDOR = Tungsten Graphics, Inc
|

14th December 2011, 01:06 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,158

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
@incident41
I believe you should have the following installed for Intel GPU's (generally speaking):
xorg-x11-drv-intel*
mesa-dri-drivers*
libva*
Below is what I get with Intel HD3000 in F15.
{I am not sure if your GM45 supports vaapi from Livba or not.}
What does glxinfo report?
Code:
$ glxinfo | grep direct
direct rendering: Yes
What does vainfo report?
Code:
$ vainfo
libva: libva version 0.32.0
libva: va_getDriverName() returns 0
libva: Trying to open /usr/lib64/dri/i965_drv_video.so
libva: va_openDriver() returns 0
vainfo: VA API version: 0.32
vainfo: Driver version: i965 Driver 0.1
vainfo: Supported profile and entrypoints
VAProfileMPEG2Simple : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileMPEG2Main : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileH264Baseline : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileH264Baseline : VAEntrypointEncSlice
VAProfileH264Main : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileH264Main : VAEntrypointEncSlice
VAProfileH264High : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileH264High : VAEntrypointEncSlice
VAProfileVC1Simple : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileVC1Main : VAEntrypointVLD
VAProfileVC1Advanced : VAEntrypointVLD
EDIT: A little more info (this is what I have installed):
Code:
$ rpm -qa | grep intel
xorg-x11-drv-intel-2.15.0-5.fc15.x86_64
$ rpm -qa | grep mesa
mesa-libGLU-7.11-1.fc15.i686
mesa-dri-filesystem-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
mesa-demos-7.10-4.20101028.fc15.x86_64
mesa-libGL-7.11-1.fc15.i686
mesa-dri-drivers-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
mesa-libGL-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
mesa-dri-llvmcore-7.11-0.16.20110709.0.fc15.x86_64
mesa-libGLU-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
$ rpm -qa | grep libva
libva-freeworld-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
libva-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
libva-devel-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
libva-utils-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
__________________
Fedora 18 Gnome on a ThinkPad X220, i5-2540M CPU, Intel HD Graphics 3000, Intel N 6205 wireless, and Sierra Wireless 754S Mobile Hotspot (AT&T)
Last edited by David Batson; 14th December 2011 at 01:54 AM.
|

14th December 2011, 10:24 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
Thanks David - stuff seems fine... in F15:
Code:
[root@duff log]# egrep 'libva|xorg-x11-drv-intel|mesa-dri' yum.log
Aug 04 23:17:18 Updated: xorg-x11-drv-intel-2.15.0-5.fc15.x86_64
Aug 13 15:10:56 Updated: mesa-dri-filesystem-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
Aug 13 15:11:00 Updated: mesa-dri-drivers-7.11-1.fc15.x86_64
Aug 29 21:14:59 Updated: libva-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
Dec 14 11:11:51 Installed: libva-utils-1.0.14-1.fc15.x86_64
[libva-utils wasn't installed by default in F15, but vainfo doesn't work with
my GM45...]
in F16:
Code:
[root@duff log]# egrep 'libva|xorg-x11-drv-intel|mesa-dri' yum.log
Dec 13 22:11:01 Updated: mesa-dri-filesystem-7.11.2-1.fc16.x86_64
Dec 13 22:13:58 Updated: mesa-dri-drivers-7.11.2-1.fc16.x86_64
Dec 13 22:15:46 Updated: xorg-x11-drv-intel-2.17.0-1.fc16.x86_64
Dec 13 22:37:53 Installed: libva-1.0.14-1.fc16.x86_64
Dec 13 22:46:58 Installed: mesa-dri-filesystem-7.11.2-1.fc16.i686
Dec 13 22:48:04 Installed: mesa-dri-drivers-7.11.2-1.fc16.i686
Dec 13 23:59:09 Installed: mesa-dri-drivers-dri1-7.11.2-1.fc16.x86_64
only weird thing I can spot is the apparent re-installation of mesa-dri-filesystem and -drivers (-dri1 was a later attempt of mine at fixing things, which turned out in no change)... since I did positively _not_ reinstall those packages.
I'll give a spin at uninstalling/reinstalling mesa-dri-* later.
[edit] Ah, never mind - those further entries are the i686 ones. The mystery remains unsolved :/
Last edited by incident41; 14th December 2011 at 10:25 AM.
Reason: spotted i686 vs x86_64 package arch differences
|

14th December 2011, 10:25 PM
|
 |
Fedora QA Community Monkey
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 3,764

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
vainfo and libva-related things generally have to do with video playback acceleration, not 3D acceleration. so leave those out of the equation.
Now I think about it, the "GL_VENDOR = VMware, Inc." line really just means that VMware get the credit for the llvmpipe driver, I think, so there's nothing inherently to do with VMware here.
The mystery is indeed the apparent inconsistency between X and glxinfo / gnome-shell as to whether hardware 3D rendering is being used. But I really dunno what's going on there. It may be best just to file a bug, I think.
|

15th December 2011, 11:43 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waldorf, Maryland
Posts: 6,105

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
The bug is in ASSUMING hardware acceleration is provided by one thing and not the other.
Yes, it may be accelerated, or it may be done in software. But using the names for the method/vendor is not related to the hardware.
|

15th December 2011, 12:52 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,158

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamW
well, AFAICT, nothing is lying to you. gnome-session-check-accelerated fails because it thinks there's no hardware 3D acceleration, and indeed there *is* none, according to glxinfo:
OpenGL vendor string: VMware, Inc.
OpenGL renderer string: Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe
OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.11
that right there is software rendering (llvmpipe is the modern software 3D system). It seems from this that the system in question is a VMware VM, so I'd guess that you somehow had working 3D passthrough in VMWare prior to the update but not after?
|
I believe Adam was on the trail here. Llvmpipe is:
Quote:
|
The Gallium llvmpipe driver is a software rasterizer that uses LLVM to do runtime code generation. Shaders, point/line/triangle rasterization and vertex processing are implemented with LLVM IR which is translated to x86 or x86-64 machine code. Also, the driver is multithreaded to take advantage of multiple CPU cores (up to 8 at this time). It's the fastest software rasterizer for Mesa.
|
http://www.mesa3d.org/llvmpipe.html
I think you are getting 3D acceleration, but not in hardware. You would be using the Mesa driver for hardware acceleration instead of Gallium/Llvmpipe.
http://intellinuxgraphics.org/2011Q3.html
__________________
Fedora 18 Gnome on a ThinkPad X220, i5-2540M CPU, Intel HD Graphics 3000, Intel N 6205 wireless, and Sierra Wireless 754S Mobile Hotspot (AT&T)
|

15th December 2011, 02:58 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Daly City CA
Age: 75
Posts: 9

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
This discussion appears to be headed to a solution of the problem, however, I do not understand the
discussion or the terms used in it.
John, age 73
|

17th December 2011, 10:17 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
Quote:
Originally Posted by jpollard
The bug is in ASSUMING hardware acceleration is provided by one thing and not the other.
Yes, it may be accelerated, or it may be done in software. But using the names for the method/vendor is not related to the hardware.
|
Right, so why does F16 insist in using software acceleration rather than hardware on the same dual-boot box where F15 happily uses hardware acceleration ?
My issue is still alive after today's refresh, with xorg-x11-drv-intel-2.17.0-4.fc16.x86_64.
GLX strings from Xorg.0.log are identical in F15 and F16:
Code:
[root@duff ~]# grep -i glx /f15/var/log/Xorg.0.log | cut -c14-
(II) LoadModule: "glx"
(II) Loading /usr/lib64/xorg/modules/extensions/libglx.so
(II) Module glx: vendor="X.Org Foundation"
(==) AIGLX enabled
(II) Loading extension GLX
(II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_MESA_copy_sub_buffer
(II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_INTEL_swap_event
(II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_SGI_swap_control and GLX_MESA_swap_control
(II) AIGLX: enabled GLX_SGI_make_current_read
(II) AIGLX: GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap backed by buffer objects
(II) AIGLX: Loaded and initialized /usr/lib64/dri/i965_dri.so
(II) GLX: Initialized DRI2 GL provider for screen 0
The final part of ltrace -S /usr/libexec/gnome-session-check-accelerated in F16:
Code:
SYS_mprotect(0x7f84f2cef000, 4096, 1) = -1971151552
SYS_mprotect(0x3bae80f000, 4096, 1) = -1971151552
SYS_mprotect(0x3baf003000, 4096, 1) = -1971151552
SYS_mprotect(0x7f84f2f23000, 4096, 1) = -1971151552
SYS_munmap(0x7f84fc8c8000, 100929) = -1971151552
SYS_brk(NULL) = NULL
SYS_brk(0x00f27000) = NULL
<... gtk_init resumed> ) = 1
gdk_display_get_default(0xdd1e10, 0xdd1e00, 1, 1, 80) = 0xe02000
gdk_x11_get_default_root_xwindow(0xdd1e00, 0xdd1e00, 1, 1, 80) = 177
gdk_x11_get_xatom_by_name_for_display(0xe02000, 0x401310, 1, 1, 0xdd5220 <unfinished ...>
SYS_poll(0x7fff8a82a4a0, 1, -1) = -67361223
SYS_writev(3, 0x7fff8a82a560, 3) = 140209140016697
SYS_poll(0x7fff8a82a4e0, 1, -1) = -67361223
SYS_read(3, "\001", 4096) = 140209140016697
SYS_read(3, "\001", 4096) = 140209140016697
SYS_read(3, "\001", 4096) = 140209140016697
<... gdk_x11_get_xatom_by_name_for_display resumed> ) = 378
gdk_x11_display_error_trap_push(0xe02000, 0, 45, 64, 114) = 0xdf1c20
gdk_x11_display_get_xdisplay(0xe02000, 0, 0xdf1c10, 0x7f84fbacb2c0, 24) = 0xdf6c30
XGetWindowProperty(0xdf6c30, 177, 378, 0, 0x7fffffffffffffff <unfinished ...>
SYS_poll(0x7fff8a82a4a0, 1, -1) = 14688256
SYS_writev(3, 0x7fff8a82a560, 3) = 14688256
SYS_poll(0x7fff8a82a4e0, 1, -1) = 14688256
SYS_read(3, "\001 \206", 4096) = 14688256
SYS_read(3, "\001 \206", 4096) = 14688256
SYS_read(3, "\001 \206", 4096) = 14688256
<... XGetWindowProperty resumed> ) = 0
gdk_x11_display_error_trap_pop_ignored(0xe02000, 0xffffffff, 0, 0x7f84fb8ad710, 0xde42d0) = 0
SYS_exit_group(1 <no return ...>
+++ exited (status 1) +++
If there's any idea on how to go from here - I'm all ears. Failing that, I'll file a bug and will post the bug# here for reference.
In the meantime, thanks for the assistance so far, it's much appreciated !
|

18th December 2011, 08:17 AM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 69

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
I have similar situation.
Output of lshw-gui of my old ThinkPad x61 is:
- CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo CPU T7500 @ 2.20GHz
- VGA: Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller
Gnome 3.2.1 System Info is showing:
- Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo CPU T7500 @ 2.20GHz x 2
- Graphics: Intel 965GM
- OS type: 64-bit
Output of lshw-gui of my new ThinkPad x220 is:
- CPU: Intel Core i7-2640M CPU @ 2.8GHz
- 2nd Generation Core Processor Family Integrated Graphics Controller
Gnome 3.2.1 System Info is showing:
- Processor: Intel Core i7-2640M CPU @ 2.80GHz x 4
- Graphics: Gallium 0.4 on llvmpipe
- OS type: 64-bit
Both machines are installed with Fedora 16 x86_64.
The old X61 can run in Gnome 3 standard mode but X220 can only run in fallback mode.
But the i7-2640M CPU should have Intel HD 3000 graphics processor which support hardware acceleration.
Why Gnome 3 can run standard mode on old CPU but can't on new CPU?
Thanks.
C.N.
Last edited by tsangcn; 18th December 2011 at 08:19 AM.
|

19th December 2011, 01:53 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 8

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
|

22nd December 2011, 10:55 PM
|
|
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 10

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
I got the same problem on my brand new HP Dm1 4050 notebook. The system runs F15 perfect with external monitor support and fast frame rate graphics. When I install F16 I can only seem to run the system with the nomodeset kernel parameter and I get no external monitor and crappy graphics response. No idea how to solve this. I do appreciate the thread because it gave me the idea to install F15 which lets me use my external monitor.
|

24th December 2011, 06:37 AM
|
 |
Registered User
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SF Bay Area, California
Posts: 1

|
|
|
Re: Gnome 3 Standard mode not working
I just upgraded to FC16 today and also encoutered the issue with Gnome 3 not using my Core i3-2100 Intel HD Graphics 2000.
I followed all the steps above, and got the same results (still Gnome 3 in fallback mode).
Anyway, I noticed that when I boot it was all in text mode (something FC15 wasn't doing before the upgrade).
So, in order to disable this I went in as root and edited /etc/default/grub and removed the ' nomodeset' from the GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX option.
then I backed up my old grub2 config file
Code:
cp /boot/grub2/grub.cfg /boot/grub2/grub.cfg.old
and regenerated it
Code:
grub2-mkconfig -o /boot/grub2/grub.cfg
Upon next boot you'll I found that my graphics are now working again.
If you don't want to go through all of this trouble just to test this out and find out that it doesn't work. Another option is to press 'e' at the grub2 boot screen and delete the nomodeset kernel parameter for a single boot. This way you can try this fix without actually risking anything.
Last edited by jimcoleman7; 24th December 2011 at 06:53 AM.
|
| Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
|
| Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
Current GMT-time: 12:07 (Wednesday, 22-05-2013)
|
|
 |
 |
 |
 |
|
|