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  #16  
Old 10th June 2011, 09:29 AM
TheNosh Offline
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linuxchrome
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sej7278 View Post
which is why i'm strongly considering switching to debian 6 after 10+ years as a redhat guy, i think debian will be winning a lot of ubuntu refugees too.

how's it going using SL6 as a desktop? seems like a pretty major step back to me, although at least you're rid of the 6 monthly rebuild rubbish which is killing fedora.
If you hate reinstalling so frequently (though, really you can go a year in Fedora, which still isn't much, but it's better than 6 months.), you may wan't to try the testing branch of Debian. Everyone I know who's used it says it's fine for day to day use, and it's a rolling release, so as long as things are working you never need to reinstall.
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  #17  
Old 10th June 2011, 11:58 AM
fnj Offline
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Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leigh123linux View Post
What am I missing?

Code:
[leigh@main_pc ~]$ rpm -qa kernel\* *\nvidia\* vlc\* ffmpeg\* *\mplayer\* firefox\* qbittorrent\* |sort
ffmpeg-0.7-0.1.rc1.el6.x86_64
ffmpeg-devel-0.7-0.1.rc1.el6.x86_64
ffmpeg-libs-0.7-0.1.rc1.el6.x86_64
firefox-3.6.17-1.el6_0.x86_64
firefox4-4.0.1-2.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
gnome-mplayer-1.0.3-2.puias6.x86_64
gnome-mplayer-common-1.0.3-2.puias6.x86_64
gnome-mplayer-nautilus-1.0.3-2.puias6.x86_64
kernel-2.6.39.1-1.el6.x86_64
kernel-3.0-0.rc2.git0.1.el6.x86_64
kernel-devel-2.6.39.1-1.el6.x86_64
kernel-devel-3.0-0.rc2.git0.1.el6.x86_64
kernel-headers-3.0-0.rc2.git0.1.el6.x86_64
kmod-nvidia-2.6.39.1-1.el6.x86_64-270.41.19-2.el6.x86_64
kmod-nvidia-3.0-0.rc2.git0.1.el6.x86_64-270.41.19-2.el6.x86_64
mplayer-1.0-0.123.20110412svn.el6.x86_64
mplayer-common-1.0-0.123.20110412svn.el6.x86_64
mplayer-gui-1.0-0.123.20110412svn.el6.x86_64
mplayer-tools-1.0-0.123.20110412svn.el6.x86_64
nvidia-settings-1.0-9.el6.x86_64
nvidia-xconfig-1.0-7.el6.x86_64
qbittorrent-2.8.1-1.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
qbittorrent-nox-2.8.1-1.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
smplayer-0.6.9-2.el6.x86_64
vlc-1.1.9-2.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
vlc-core-1.1.9-2.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
vlc-extras-1.1.9-2.el6.leigh123linux.x86_64
xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-270.41.19-1.el6.x86_64
xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-devel-270.41.19-1.el6.x86_64
xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs-270.41.19-1.el6.i686
xorg-x11-drv-nvidia-libs-270.41.19-1.el6.x86_64
apart from gnome 3
You ain't missing a damn thing from where I stand, bud. Unity and Gnome3 are an insulting crock, KDE4 just too buggy after SEVEN point releases and slightly too weird anyway, Xfce is too primitive, Trinity is missing too much, the others are not for me. Gnome2 was so close to perfection that I don't care about the difference between it and perfection. I'm ready to jump ship. I am already running SL6 on two servers and I like and respect RHEL/SL very much (RIP CentOS?).

You are a GOD if you tell me how to get that new kernel stuff in SL6 (both 2.6.39 and 3.0) and some of that other new stuff.

---------- Post added at 06:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:47 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xavior View Post
It's ok buddy, I think the words you are looking for is... "[Gnome3] Sucks!"
That is putting it MILDLY. I'm like you; I've seen GUI's develop from nothing to fully perfected, and they just couldn't leave it alone. Something drove them to ruin it.

---------- Post added at 06:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:52 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by sej7278 View Post
how's it going using SL6 as a desktop? seems like a pretty major step back to me ...
I don't think it's much of a step back at all. Don't fixate on the 2.6.32 kernel. Redhat backports the good stuff from later kernels. The app packages do get old over time, but that is fixable for the few apps you must have in absolutely latest form.
  #18  
Old 10th June 2011, 11:58 AM
leigh123linux
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Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fnj View Post
You ain't missing a damn thing from where I stand, bud. Unity and Gnome3 are an insulting crock, KDE4 just too buggy after SEVEN point releases and slightly too weird anyway, Xfce is too primitive, Trinity is missing too much, the others are not for me. Gnome2 was so close to perfection that I don't care about the difference between it and perfection. I'm ready to jump ship. I am already running SL6 on two servers and I like and respect RHEL/SL very much (RIP CentOS?).

You are a GOD if you tell me how to get that new kernel stuff in SL6 (both 2.6.39 and 3.0) and some of that other new stuff.

---------- Post added at 06:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:47 AM ----------



That is putting it MILDLY. I'm like you; I've seen GUI's develop from nothing to fully perfected, and they just couldn't leave it alone. Something drove them to ruin it.

For the kernel try

http://scientificlinuxforum.org/index.php?showtopic=153

and post #4 should help

http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=262025

There are some epel6 repos here

http://repos.fedorapeople.org/

For multimedia apps + more

Code:
rpm -Uvh http://leigh123linux.fedorapeople.org/pub/rpm/puias-6-addons-release-1-1.noarch.rpm

+ more (you will need bits from here to build the kernel)

Code:
rpm -Uvh http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/epel/6/i386/epel-release-6-5.noarch.rpm

http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/...tml/RPM_Guide/
  #19  
Old 10th June 2011, 12:07 PM
sej7278 Offline
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linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheNosh View Post
If you hate reinstalling so frequently (though, really you can go a year in Fedora, which still isn't much, but it's better than 6 months.), you may wan't to try the testing branch of Debian. Everyone I know who's used it says it's fine for day to day use, and it's a rolling release, so as long as things are working you never need to reinstall.
yes i've got to look into debian in detail as there are 3 branches it seems, stable is probably going to be too old for my liking, and one of the branches (testing or unstable?) sounds like its more bleeding edge ***** than fedora, so the one in the middle might be nice for me.

otherwise it seems SL6 with a load of 3rd party packages and rebuilt rpm's, but if you're doing that you might as well just go gentoo.
  #20  
Old 10th June 2011, 12:39 PM
fnj Offline
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Posts: 62
linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sej7278 View Post
yes i've got to look into debian in detail as there are 3 branches it seems, stable is probably going to be too old for my liking, and one of the branches (testing or unstable?) sounds like its more bleeding edge ***** than fedora, so the one in the middle might be nice for me.

otherwise it seems SL6 with a load of 3rd party packages and rebuilt rpm's, but if you're doing that you might as well just go gentoo.
Just adding epel, rpmforge, and/or a couple of other add-on repos to SL6 so yum just uses them transparently is in no way comparable to the backbreaking work of making gentoo into a stable and complete installation and keeping it updated.
  #21  
Old 10th June 2011, 06:37 PM
SomeDamFool Offline
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linuxfedorafirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

I upgraded from F14 to 15 and found that Gnome 3 isn't perfect, but it isn't nearly as scary as I thought it would be. I found tweaks (on this forum) to make it a bit more Gnome 2 like.

The only problem was dependency hell trying to do 785 updates after the upgrade. I got all but 80 installed so far.

I was able to fix or tweak everything that really bugged me about G3, and it seems usable now... different, but usable. I'll give it a go for a couple of weeks and if worst comes to worst I already have KDE and XFCE installed and tweaked to my liking.
Mike
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  #22  
Old 10th June 2011, 07:01 PM
fnj Offline
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Posts: 62
linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leigh123linux View Post
For the kernel try

http://scientificlinuxforum.org/index.php?showtopic=153

and post #4 should help

http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=262025

There are some epel6 repos here

http://repos.fedorapeople.org/

For multimedia apps + more

Code:
rpm -Uvh http://leigh123linux.fedorapeople.org/pub/rpm/puias-6-addons-release-1-1.noarch.rpm

+ more (you will need bits from here to build the kernel)

Code:
rpm -Uvh http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/epel/6/i386/epel-release-6-5.noarch.rpm

http://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/...tml/RPM_Guide/
Thank you so much for these tips! Does epel have anything that rpmforge does not? Do you know if Dag's concerns expressed here ever got resolved?

http://lists.centos.org/pipermail/ce...ly/041982.html

What do you think of rpmfusion? (It appears to be broken at the moment for RHEL6, but assuming it's just a mirroring issue)
  #23  
Old 10th June 2011, 08:53 PM
sej7278 Offline
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linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fnj View Post
Just adding epel, rpmforge, and/or a couple of other add-on repos to SL6 so yum just uses them transparently is in no way comparable to the backbreaking work of making gentoo into a stable and complete installation and keeping it updated.
but are so many mixed repo's reliable or do we end up with the fiasco we used to have when mixing atrpms with any other repo?

at the moment i just use rpmfusion - well and the flash/google/virtualbox ones, but they're just one package per repo.
  #24  
Old 10th June 2011, 10:53 PM
fnj Offline
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Posts: 62
linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sej7278 View Post
but are so many mixed repo's reliable or do we end up with the fiasco we used to have when mixing atrpms with any other repo?

at the moment i just use rpmfusion - well and the flash/google/virtualbox ones, but they're just one package per repo.
As I recall, the conflict was mostly evident when combining atrpms with livna or perhaps it was another whose name I cannot recall. I believe the two basically merged at some point and became rpmfusion, eliminating that headache.

Yes, I think on the whole it is best to stay if possible with one well designed general purpose addon repo (not counting highly specific repos as you mention), whether it be rpmforge or epel. Yes, I remember back in the day when I had atrpms in combination with something else, problems were had. The reason I had to add the something else was when I discovered something was missing from atrpms. I think rpmforge is more complete now. We do have yum-priorities and "yum --enablereo install <specific-package>" now to ameliorate the multiple repo problems to some degree, though they still demand wise use.

The addon repo is mostly necessary to get around the infernal bother of not having such necessities as mplayer, vlc, libdvdcss, and the nvidia and ati closed source drivers, in the "real" repo. I do understand why some can't and some maybe shouldn't be in the main repo for a distro which is based in the US.

Last edited by fnj; 10th June 2011 at 10:58 PM.
  #25  
Old 11th June 2011, 03:19 PM
Jon Baron Offline
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Posts: 15
linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

I've been using RedHat, then Fedora, for 15 years. Metacity with Gnome 2 and Fedora 14 was, in my opinion, perfection. I am a professor and I use the computer to get work done. With 8 workspaces in a geometric layout, I was able to keep one project in reach while dealing with another. When I wanted to give presentations with my Thinkpad, the external projector worked with no fuss, and I could switch workspaces there too. I had a single panel at the bottom with everything on it, in places where I wanted them.

I installed Fedora 15 on one computer and am not going to install it anywhere else. I will stick with Fedora 14, and then, when that is no longer maintained, go somewhere else, unless I can put back my old set-up without spending hours reconfiguring. Gnome 3 is a disaster. I spent some time trying to tinker with it, and it is just too hard. I have better things to do.

For those who want to try where I left off, I did find
http://fedorasolved.org/Members/bookwar/gnome-3-tips
which talks about fallback-mode, but it comes nowhere near replicating the old set-up. I cannot move icons on the panel, or change the size of the panel, or drag icons from the top panel to the bottom one (so that I can remove the top one).

Jon Baron (baron@psych.upenn.edu)
  #26  
Old 12th June 2011, 08:07 AM
dvavra Offline
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linuxfedorafirefox
Unhappy Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

F15 is fine but GNOME3 is the worst I've seen in a long time. It's definitely a step (or three) backwards from GNOME2. I heard that an impetus for change was that newbies somehow thought the old interface was too hard. There's an old quote (forget the source) for that kind of thinking: "If you create a system that any idiot can use, then only idiots will find it useful." There's also another useful adage: "If it ain't broke; don't fix it!"

The G3 interface forces me to take far too many steps to accomplish what I could do with G2 in one. For example, I keep multiple desktops to separate my tasks and to group common windows associated with those tasks. I often want to flip back and forth between them. Now with G3, to get from one space to another, I have to click either the "activities" then "applications" or find the hidden dash button (which requires hunting because it's so damn small) all on the LEFT side of the screen after which I can go to the unmovable workspace display on the RIGHT. That disappears as soon as I make a single click on it. Why anyone would think making multiple clicks on opposite ends of the screen is easier than a single click is way beyond me.I suspect some relative newbie fancies him/herself an expert on user interfaces but, if GNOME3 is any clue, they have much to learn.

Not to mention I can't minimize windows anymore or place buttons in a convenient out-of-the-way place to activate things that need frequent activation.

Yes, there are "tweaks" but they still don't return all the previous functionality. It's also a bit like referring to a trip to the body shop after a fender-bender as a tweak to a new design. Much better if the tweaks had remained unnecessary.

If you haven't guessed already, I wish Fedora had warned me before springing a major interface change on me. In any case, I fussed around with GNOME3 for the last several days and finally installed XFCE and find it does everything that I want. I may never go back to GNOME.

If any GNOME developer should come to me for a job, my advice would be to not mention that little tidbit -- I'm far from impressed.

[/rant]
  #27  
Old 12th October 2011, 01:10 AM
pure_ev1l Offline
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Thumbs down Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

I am so angry! have been on Fedora for years (as alternatives suck) now I am about a year away from leaving.

Bring back Gnome 2, this is supposed to be open and free, feels like closed oppression to me!

Fedora wasn't for the people that are ipad w*nkers, it was for geeks that use their brain, now you go the way of ubuntu and make it another ipad w*nker distro.

no icons, ****** effects, all done with the mouse, MAY AS WELL INSTALL VISTA!

you should be ashamed.
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Last edited by pure_ev1l; 12th October 2011 at 01:12 AM.
  #28  
Old 24th April 2012, 04:49 AM
timliim Offline
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Location: Ol' US of A
Posts: 74
linuxfirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

In case you are interested, please find my interim solution at
Code:
    http://formosa.homelinux.com/pub/fedora/gnome2/GNOME2.F16.html
also on Fedora forum
Using GNOME2 on Fedora 16
Cheers,
Tim Taiwanese Liim
  #29  
Old 24th April 2012, 04:58 AM
Dan Offline
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Posts: 23,279
linuxfedorafirefox
Re: F15 and Gnome2 - Fork?

This one wasn't quite necromancy, but it was a wee bit stale. <....>


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