Fedora Linux Support Community & Resources Center
  #1  
Old 21st October 2009, 11:32 PM
Jongi Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,952
linuxfedorafirefox
Is it possible to remove PulseAudio from a running system?

Basically what the title says? Or is it integrated into the workings of Fedora?
__________________
Desktop (64-bit) - F12, Debian Sid, OpenSUSE 11.2, ArchLinux
  #2  
Old 22nd October 2009, 12:22 AM
jpollard Online
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Waldorf, Maryland
Posts: 6,860
linuxfedorafirefox
It is possible. Most utilities would then default to whatever sound system remains (ALSA?), but some utilities
could fail.

What is the real problem?
  #3  
Old 22nd October 2009, 03:03 AM
dd_wizard Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,409
linuxfedorafirefox
I recently did a fresh install of beta RC2 on a pretty small partition, so I left out a few things including PulseAudio. So far, the audio seems fine. Rhythym Box, Totem, Mplayer, Flash in FireFox all work the same as my old install of alpha that had Pulse Audio. KDE uses HAL instead of Pulse I believe, so it looks like Gnome Volume Control is talking to somebody.

EDIT: NM, i just checked and PulseAudio must have been a dependency as it was installed even though I unchecked it in the install options.

Last edited by dd_wizard; 22nd October 2009 at 03:08 AM.
  #4  
Old 22nd October 2009, 06:49 AM
AdamW Offline
Fedora QA Community Monkey
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 4,186
linuxfedorafirefox
you can remove it if you're really determined to, but in most cases you might as well just remove alsa-plugins-pulseaudio and ensure apps are configured to output to ALSA rather than PA, that way it'll be running but not actually in use. or do the above and have 'pulseaudio -k' run at each login, to kill PA off. removing the package will take some other bits you might want with it, this isn't optimal but it's hard to remove those dependencies without causing other issues.
__________________
Adam Williamson | awilliam AT redhat DOT com
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora
http://www.happyassassin.net
  #5  
Old 22nd October 2009, 07:12 AM
ozjd Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Sydney Australia
Age: 59
Posts: 2,371
linuxfedorafirefox
If you want to improve PA rather that remove it have a look at the PulseAudio thread in my signature.
  #6  
Old 22nd October 2009, 12:05 PM
Jongi Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,952
windows_xp_2003ie
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamW View Post
you can remove it if you're really determined to, but in most cases you might as well just remove alsa-plugins-pulseaudio and ensure apps are configured to output to ALSA rather than PA, that way it'll be running but not actually in use. or do the above and have 'pulseaudio -k' run at each login, to kill PA off. removing the package will take some other bits you might want with it, this isn't optimal but it's hard to remove those dependencies without causing other issues.

Thanks for that. Will try out this evening.

I just see no tangible benefit to the extra hassle that PA adds. Even with doing the alsamixer –c0 trick there is no sound coming out. While it is very likely that there is a not too complex solution to the problem, on other distros I have installed without PA I haven’t had to do anything extra after ALSA is installed.
__________________
Desktop (64-bit) - F12, Debian Sid, OpenSUSE 11.2, ArchLinux
  #7  
Old 22nd October 2009, 03:20 PM
droidhacker Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 827
linuxfedorafirefox
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jongi View Post
I just see no tangible benefit to the extra hassle that PA adds.
--mixing of multiple audio tracks,
--seamless switching between multiple output devices/profiles
--audio client and server located on different physical machines
--independent control of audio levels for multiple audio streams
--multi-platform audio networks
...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulseaudio


To what extra "hassle" do you refer? It was hopelessly broken in F8, marginal in F9, I never used F10, perfect in F11 and F12. You're not one of those people who just got in the HABIT of not using PA due to its rough start, are you?

Last edited by droidhacker; 22nd October 2009 at 03:27 PM.
  #8  
Old 22nd October 2009, 06:39 PM
Jongi Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,952
linuxdebianmozilla
There isn't one of the PA features that makes me think ooh now there is something that has been lacking for me in linux for a long time. Alsa fulfills all my needs quite perfectly.

And so as I stated, given that I haven't had to fiddle with alsa, PA is adding negatives when there are no positives that i feel i am gaining. for me any product that does that is failing.

EDIT: Thanks Adam, removing the alsa-plugins-pulseaudio did the trick
__________________
Desktop (64-bit) - F12, Debian Sid, OpenSUSE 11.2, ArchLinux

Last edited by Jongi; 22nd October 2009 at 06:50 PM.
  #9  
Old 23rd October 2009, 04:11 PM
droidhacker Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 827
linuxfedorafirefox
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jongi View Post
There isn't one of the PA features that makes me think ooh now there is something that has been lacking for me in linux for a long time. Alsa fulfills all my needs quite perfectly.

And so as I stated, given that I haven't had to fiddle with alsa, PA is adding negatives when there are no positives that i feel i am gaining. for me any product that does that is failing.

EDIT: Thanks Adam, removing the alsa-plugins-pulseaudio did the trick
The question I ask is exactly WHAT "fiddling" does it need? Seems to me to work perfectly without any "fiddling".

And that feature about mixing multiple audio tracks is a BIG one. Take for example the situation where you have a music track or system sound playing at the same moment when you accept an incoming SIP call (ekiga or whatever you use). It means that your SIP client will fail to gain access to the sound device, which means NO SOUND. That is a pretty *MAJOR* problem for not having PA. esd used to do this, but that doesn't exist any more.
  #10  
Old 23rd October 2009, 07:17 PM
Dies Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,754
macossafari
Quote:
Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
The question I ask is exactly WHAT "fiddling" does it need? Seems to me to work perfectly without any "fiddling".

And that feature about mixing multiple audio tracks is a BIG one. Take for example the situation where you have a music track or system sound playing at the same moment when you accept an incoming SIP call (ekiga or whatever you use). It means that your SIP client will fail to gain access to the sound device, which means NO SOUND. That is a pretty *MAJOR* problem for not having PA. esd used to do this, but that doesn't exist any more.
Why would someone want to argue with someone over what THEY want to do with THEIR system?

Especially after they just said they have no sound, the 'fiddling', and they said they don't care for or need the features Pulse provides.


// a SIP call ? really?

// Don't mind me...
// Just thinking aloud...
  #11  
Old 24th October 2009, 05:03 PM
AdamW Offline
Fedora QA Community Monkey
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 4,186
linuxfedorafirefox
droidhacker: the situation varies depending on your hardware. It's great that PA works flawlessly for you, and it does that for a lot more people than it used to, but there are cases where it doesn't.

Stream mixing isn't really one of the big comparative features of PA, because plain ALSA does that anyway. You don't lose that feature without PA.
__________________
Adam Williamson | awilliam AT redhat DOT com
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora
http://www.happyassassin.net
  #12  
Old 25th October 2009, 07:18 PM
TarrasQ Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Oulu, Finland
Posts: 74
linuxfedorafirefox
I'd love to see Pulse work flawlessy, but it doesn't. I've tried all kinds of tricks on different HW to have working sound in a game that uses oss, but it only worked when I enabled OSS or shut down Pulse. Whenever I start a thread about it, people start discussing PA's architecture and not my problem at hand.

I removed Pulse from one of my machines and I think that the primary thing keeping it as a dependency was gnome-bluetooth. I uninstalling it doesn't bother you, then it's not a big issue to remove PA from a system completely.
  #13  
Old 25th October 2009, 08:27 PM
Jongi Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,952
linuxdebianmozilla
Quote:
Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
The question I ask is exactly WHAT "fiddling" does it need? Seems to me to work perfectly without any "fiddling".

And that feature about mixing multiple audio tracks is a BIG one. Take for example the situation where you have a music track or system sound playing at the same moment when you accept an incoming SIP call (ekiga or whatever you use). It means that your SIP client will fail to gain access to the sound device, which means NO SOUND. That is a pretty *MAJOR* problem for not having PA. esd used to do this, but that doesn't exist any more.
you seem to have a problem reading. my sound didn't work with PA in FC12. Removing it made my sound work. I have a number of distros installed that use ALSA (no PA) that required no work after installing the distro. So instead of fiddling with PA, I wanted to know how to remove it seeing as I know my hardware works without PA installed.

As has been stated above, ALSA plays multiple audio sources quite fine. I control the volume of each app by going into the individual app. You also seem to be willing me to use sound features that I haven't used since PA was introduced.

What would convince you that I do not need PA?
__________________
Desktop (64-bit) - F12, Debian Sid, OpenSUSE 11.2, ArchLinux
  #14  
Old 27th October 2009, 03:31 AM
AdamW Offline
Fedora QA Community Monkey
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 4,186
linuxfedorafirefox
tarrasq: it's very difficult for any other sound system (not just PA) to cope with OSS apps, because of the way the OSS API works.

You basically have two choices. The best option is to run the OSS app through 'padsp', which is a wrapper for OSS applications which tries to make them work with PA. It doesn't work for all, but it does for some. Run 'padsp appname' instead of just 'appname', and see if that helps.

The other is just to run 'pasuspender appname', which simply disables PA as long as the app is running.

This is a bit of a shame, yep, but it's genuinely something PA really can't do much about. It's worth noting ALSA isn't able to do software mixing with unwrapped OSS-type apps either, if you run an OSS-type app when using plain ALSA then sound from all other apps is blocked as long as that app's running (same as if you use pasuspender with PA). It's not a PA-specific problem, just how the OSS interface works.
__________________
Adam Williamson | awilliam AT redhat DOT com
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | identi.ca: adamwfedora
http://www.happyassassin.net
  #15  
Old 30th October 2009, 08:42 PM
Jongi Offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,952
linuxfedorafirefox
I happened to install gnome (I installed F12 via a KDE LiveCD).

Now for some reason PA starts up everytime (in KDE)

Code:
jongi-main ~ # ps aux | grep pulse
jongi     2857  0.0  0.0 486672  4768 ?        S<sl 21:25   0:00 /usr/bin/pulseaudio --start --log-target=syslog
pulseausio -k doesn't work
Code:
jongi-main ~ # pulseaudio -k
E: main.c: Failed to kill daemon: No such process
These are the installed PA packages
Code:
jongi-main ~ # yum list *pulse* | grep @
pulseaudio.x86_64                            0.9.19-1.fc12              @rawhide
pulseaudio-libs.x86_64                       0.9.19-1.fc12              @rawhide
pulseaudio-libs-glib2.x86_64                 0.9.19-1.fc12              @rawhide
Trying to remove any of the packages almost wants to remove the whole system. How can I find what process is starting /usr/bin/pulseaudio --start --log-target=syslog?

What is also irritating is that even after I kill the process, it somehow starts itself again.
__________________
Desktop (64-bit) - F12, Debian Sid, OpenSUSE 11.2, ArchLinux

Last edited by Jongi; 30th October 2009 at 09:24 PM.
 

Tags
pulseaudio, remove, running

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Am I doing right (pulseaudio system wide equalizer) blueskynis Using Fedora 17 24th May 2010 08:46 PM
Is there a way to remove PulseAudio? J. E. Bennett Using Fedora 13 1st December 2009 09:00 PM
system wide pulseaudio sukru Using Fedora 0 7th August 2009 09:39 AM
How Do I Remove Pulseaudio in F11? rookcifer Alpha, Beta & Snapshots Discussions (Fedora 11 Only) 0 1st June 2009 02:12 PM
How to properly remove Pulseaudio? MNKyDeth Using Fedora 12 1st March 2009 10:42 PM


Current GMT-time: 12:29 (Thursday, 02-10-2014)

TopSubscribe to XML RSS for all Threads in all ForumsFedoraForumDotOrg Archive
logo

All trademarks, and forum posts in this site are property of their respective owner(s).
FedoraForum.org is privately owned and is not directly sponsored by the Fedora Project or Red Hat, Inc.

Privacy Policy | Term of Use | Posting Guidelines | Archive | Contact Us | Founding Members

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2012, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

FedoraForum is Powered by RedHat