Cannot install using YUM (forbidden error)

[nirik]

[QUOTE=stefan1975;1222020]not wanting to play the devils' advocate here, but I believe the F11 repo switch itself took place some weeks ago already. ever since the fedora-release package was updated may 12th F11 has been updating against "stable" repos and not rawhide anymore.

Yes, the local users 'fedora.repo' file points to the what will be the final release location. However, it really doesn't. It points to mirror manager.
Which (up until thursday) took any request for Fedora 11 and just silently pointed it at rawhide. If we didn't use this trick, there would be no where to point final F11 until right at release, and it could be difficult to coordinate and get all the users using rawhide to update fedora-release right then.

And ofcourse a way to implement what JJ wanted is perhaps to stop with a repo called rawhide but name the repos after there release and keep all packages there from development until release (so a leonidas repo for F11), is that not the way ubuntu kind of implemented it?

Yes, and thats being talked about this week.

personally i don't think there is anything wrong with the current setup, i am a big fan of rolling repos (jay for arch!).

Yeah, this is a bit of an annoyance since usually there is only a day or less like this, and this cycle it's 5 days. Sorry.

[stefan1975]

just silently pointed it at rawhide

ahhhh of course, you are talking server-side and the reposwitch was just on the client, i see. my bad.

[kevaljd]

Yeah, this is a bit of an annoyance since usually there is only a day or less like this, and this cycle it's 5 days. Sorry.

True... its really BIG! but If you were stuck as I was for any type of webserver, alternative is installing lampp - apache friends and got my server up in 24 hours... by the way, I think there are changes in SELinux to enable any manual ports I had to do semanage on tht port and define the protocol too... I think this can help in securing from RAT attacks I know wait is too long but I feel, its worth

[stefan1975]

"True... its really BIG"

Ah well one could argue about the question if fedora should be put on a server at all ..... but if there are that install a prerelease of fedora - which is a prerelease for redhat's server software - and now find it a BIG annoyance that they cannot install from the repos ... i would say the had it coming. If you agree to install unreleased software ... which clearly says Do Not Install on production servers you clearly accepted the risk that something might not be finished yet. He or She should wallow in their misery for a bit and then go and install CentOS 5.3 on the fedora preview server.

stefan

[CraigWatson]

Originally Posted by stefan1975

Ah well one could argue about the question if fedora should be put on a server at all ..... but if there are that install a prerelease of fedora - which is a prerelease for redhat's server software - and now find it a BIG annoyance that they cannot install from the repos ... i would say the had it coming. If you agree to install unreleased software ... which clearly says Do Not Install on production servers you clearly accepted the risk that something might not be finished yet. He or She should wallow in their misery for a bit and then go and install CentOS 5.3 on the fedora preview server.

My feeling exactly, I have two F11 PreUpgrade installs but I knew I was installing unreleased packages, so I'd be extremely surprised if everything did "just work"

[jfprieur]

Not too sound harsh but if you don't know and accept that installing a pre-release version of Fedora may mean that your system may not be available 100%, 24/7/365, Fedora may not be the distribution for you. IF you want a Red Hat compatible distro for servers that you need 100% (or as close to it as possible) uptime, may i suggest CentOS?

[JuhaniJaakola]

I installed F11 Preview on 12.5.2009 and it has worked well. I can finally use my USB wheel with Torcs, and my bluetooth dongle works again after an update broke it in F9 last September! So "unreleased" F11 works better than relased F9 or F10!

So the software is good, but the policy with repos is BAD. I think that this kind of a pause is unnecessary. Good to hear that there will be discussion on how it can be improved.

I think that we should forget concept "rawhide". This version is F11 and the next is F12. When we want to stabilize F12 then we spawn F13 and build development packages there. Simple, isn't it?

[stefan1975]

Originally Posted by JuhaniJaakola

So the software is good, but the policy with repos is BAD. I think that this kind of a pause is unnecessary. Good to hear that there will be discussion on how it can be improved.

yeah you've made that point already, on several occasions. No use in wallowing in things that are not perfect in thde present, rather contribute constructively to the future. So did you file that RFE already at bugzilla?

[CraigWatson]

Originally Posted by JuhaniJaakola

I think that we should forget concept "rawhide". This version is F11 and the next is F12. When we want to stabilize F12 then we spawn F13 and build development packages there. Simple, isn't it?

I don't think you understand the concept of a "rolling" development system. Let me illustrate:



In the diagram above, the vertical arrow represents Rawhide, which is the spine of Fedora's development. When Fedora releases are made, they are branched from Rawhide, "new" copies of Rawhide are made, and Rawhide development is effectively frozen while the release is taking place. This - I think - is what is happening now. When Fedora 11 is released and "in the wild" (which it will be in 24 hours or under), Rawhide will be unfrozen and development will continue, ready for Fedora 12.

At the point where development continues, all Fedora 11 Alpha/Beta/Preview/RC installs should be automatically migrated to the "live" Fedora 11 repositories.

After release, new packages are worked on inside the Rawhide repository, and when tested and confirmed stable, released into the main Fedora repositories. This process is shown by the arrows joining Rawhide to Fedora Maintenance.

As you can see, Rawhide is pretty integral to Fedora's lifecycle, and as such I doubt very very much if it will be just "forgotten". I believe (and I'm fully willing to eat my words if someone proves me wrong) that a lot of other distros follow this development model. I hope that's technical enough for you JJ.

Also, you still have to accept responsibility for installing pre-release software. As previous posters (including myself) have stated, if you want a stable system, install the released version. Only install preview/beta/unreleased software and OSes if you a) know what you're doing, and b) can tolerate things going wrong. Personally, it's completely ludicrous for you to be slating the development methods and release schedules when you have installed what is - by all accounts - beta software. Whether it works or doesn't work is a non-issue. It is still beta software. You really have no cause for complaint for what is effectively part of Fedora's lifecycle and development/release pattern.

[stefan1975]

Ubuntu among them

well actually i think that ubuntu uses a repo config much like JJ preaches in this thread, i believe they have a "jaunty" repo and a "keramic" repo under which development takes place and is brought to production, i.e. they are now developing in the keramic repo and regular updates are pushed through the jaunty repo.

And incidentally I think it was another poster who had issues with F11RC on a server and that JJ actually had a pretty decent experience apart from the repos being down for the release, ofcourse running CentOS on a server is much smarter then F11RC.

Rawhide is pretty integral to Fedora's lifecycle, and as such I doubt very very much if it will be just "forgotten".

i would not go as far as forgotten, but this rawhide concept is actually point of discussion at this weeks FAD:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Fedor...ent_Cycle_2009

Currently we spend a lot of time blocking the progress of rawhide. We do this to try to get people to test the packages we're targeting for a release, instead of the packages in the ever rolling development train that is rawhide. We get a lot of anger and naval gazing particularly near the end of a release cycle where things are building up in the next rawhide tag and in the updates tag for the release we're about to make. We then have a flood of pent up changes that hit nearly all at once, breaking god knows what.

What if there was a better way?