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  #61  
Old 10th July 2012, 01:00 PM
smr54 Offline
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linuxopera
Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Well, in our case, our servers don't have a GUI, so it's not even an issue. I care less about their GUI (as it doesn't affect me) than I do about some of the other things, such as crippling text install, systemd, and that sort of thing--changing the network interface names is another--though I don't think that was aimed at the inexperienced desktop user, I think, (and I tend to think this about a lot of what one sees in Fedora) that it was something where someone is trying to show the head of their department that they're doing things.

Here's an example of what I mean. Now, my memory is vague on this, and I'm too lazy to look for the exact reference, but...

Apparently, ntp or ntpd is being replaced, by default, by chrony, and for some reason or another, whether systemd or chrony itself, there were circumstances where it would not get the time at boot. One of the RH people (and one for whom I have the utmost respect) wrote words to the effect that it wasn't the end of the world if it didn't get time at bootup.

Now, again, that's fine for the desktop/laptop user, but it shows how many of the people, in charge just don't know, or at best, don't think very much about, servers. Again, this is fine--but someone at RH will probably just throw it right into 7.x

BIG DISCLAIMER---I didn't follow the particular bug and for all I know, the person who said that completely changed their mind, or put lots of effort into fixing it so it didn't happen.

Anyway, aside from that, what Fedora does with their desktop doesn't affect me too often. However, just to give another example--not Fedora itself, but the X people, IIRC--they decided the current crop of users were so moronic that they better disable ctl+alt+backspace to kill X. It can be put back in. But...here's the thing--I can't think of too many times when I accidentally killed X at an important time--but I can think of lots of other times when this was an inconvenience. Disaster--no, usually, one can do ctl+alt+F1 or get out of it another way, but point is, it never helped me, only got in my way.

Then, we gradually get used to it. I remember Alan Cox being aggravated about the you're too stupid to be allowed to log in as root decision. Now, we are all used to it. I think Linux needs its own Stephen Colbert to point out how absurd much of this is---though, like Colbert, it will probably only be good for laughs and not get too much changed.
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  #62  
Old 10th July 2012, 01:23 PM
Dan Offline
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linuxfirefox
Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Just a quick suggestion to those who are part of Redhat's paying customer base:

Lip service on a forum, or even focused and cogent griping on an IRC channel or with a Redhat developer isn't going to get you where you need to go. Like the old saying goes, "Money talks, bull-biscuits walks." (Ok, so that's the cleaned up version.)

In short, if you want to get someone's attention over at the Crimson Cap's thinktank, write an intelligent and well worded/researched letter on company letterhead, and send it to both the sales manager, and a copy to upper corporate management. The key here is to be both reasonable, and specific about the problem, and the solution that you, as a customer, need. Back that up with a phone call straight to the upper levels of management. Don't allow yourself to be sidetracked, derailed or otherwise bed-bugged by those folks who have ego-investment and a reason to attempt to dictate your needs. Simply move around them.

Will that work? Who knows. But without that kind of positive proactive action, nothing is going to get changed. Whereas a lower level zealot may be willing to risk losing customers by "dictating" to them, somebody high enough in the corporate food chain to have a modicum of market smarts to go along with their ambitions probably will get the point if you include some basic numbers. I'm no expert, but seeing the likelihood (on paper) of several thousand desktop contracts vanishing into the wind would get my attention!

And ... from the look of the situation ... it's pretty much your last viable option before abandoning the product and company.
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  #63  
Old 10th July 2012, 02:32 PM
DBelton Offline
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Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

That is very good advice, Dan.

I can't do that in the position I am in, but for some others, it would be a very good option. (In my position, with all of the protocol and office politics, If someone other than the "official gopher" were to contact the company, it would upset the apple cart and the powers that be don't like apples all over the place.

The "official" word will happen someday, and then it will be a "change your product or lose our business" no dealing, no haggling. "You don't meet our specifications, so you don't get the contract."

They will sure do it, too. They dropped Windows like a hot potato a long time ago due to security issues that Microsoft refused to fix. (Windows 98 is the last version that can even be used on the network, and for various reasons, Windows 98 doesn't work, sooooo... Unless you have 3.11, you don't use Windows )

But, yes, for the people that can contact Redhat, that is their best (and really only) option at this point in the game. As Dan said.. Money talks....

The developers have very different priorities than the upper management. Where a developer sees a pretty screen with PlaySkool icons, upper management sees dollar signs (or in this situation, dollar signs going elsewhere)
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  #64  
Old 10th July 2012, 03:38 PM
BBQdave Offline
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Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBelton View Post
One of the main issues are the new "features" they are building into Gnome shell, like the social networking stuff. Just that one thing prevents it from being able to be installed on any machine where I work at.
I apologize, not able to site (remember) the research link, but I was reading research that indicated it was not a bad thing for employees to socially chat and/or read some fluff while working. The mild refocus of social chat, appears to help employees focus better on work tasks over a long work period.

I am sure there is the potential for abuse, but the conclusion of the research was along the lines that a good employee benefits from the mild distraction and is more productive. A bad employee is not herded or redirected to being more productive by the absence of mild distraction. So mild distraction appears to help good employees, no difference with bad employees.
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  #65  
Old 10th July 2012, 03:40 PM
CubedRoot Offline
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linuxchrome
Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQdave View Post
I apologize, not able to site (remember) the research link, but I was reading research that indicated it was not a bad thing for employees to socially chat and/or read some fluff while working. The mild refocus of social chat, appears to help employees focus better on work tasks over a long work period.

I am sure there is the potential for abuse, but the conclusion of the research was along the lines that a good employee benefits from the mild distraction and is more productive. A bad employee is not herded or redirected to being more productive by the absence of mild distraction. So mild distraction appears to help good employees, no difference with bad employees.
Yeah, but the problem is getting companies to accept this research.
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  #66  
Old 10th July 2012, 03:45 PM
Dan Offline
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linuxfirefox
Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Some work environments require a somewhat higher security level than others.
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  #67  
Old 10th July 2012, 06:57 PM
R3v0lut10nary Offline
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windows_xp_2003firefox
Re: The futuristic design of all Gnome Apps

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQdave View Post
I apologize, not able to site (remember) the research link, but I was reading research that indicated it was not a bad thing for employees to socially chat and/or read some fluff while working. The mild refocus of social chat, appears to help employees focus better on work tasks over a long work period.

I am sure there is the potential for abuse, but the conclusion of the research was along the lines that a good employee benefits from the mild distraction and is more productive. A bad employee is not herded or redirected to being more productive by the absence of mild distraction. So mild distraction appears to help good employees, no difference with bad employees.
Good employees - by definition - are conscientious enough to keep in mind their primary reason for pulling in a paycheck, and take pride in their work product as a reflection of themselves, therefore leading to good results both individually and company-wide.

Bad employees aren't, and don't.

Social networking privileges, as with anything else, won't change a good worker into a bad one, and vice-versa. The presence of a sanctioned distraction is an extraneous variable in any such experiment. But corporations, catering to the LCD and bowing at the grand altar of Political Correctness, must apply a blanket policy to these things.


Having said that, I'm not a manager or corporate-jockey and don't really ever want to be.


Now get your asses back to work.
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