focus-follows-mouse status and discussion

[SkipE]

I THINK that this is the right place for discussion given that F12 has hit the streets.

The basic loss of the control for setting gnome's focus-follows-mouse in F12 has been recognised by users and a workaround posted:
http://forums.fedoraforum.org/showthread.php?t=232677&highlight=focus-follows-mouse

It seems that this is as much bending to the upstream gnome folks directions as bending to the full desires of the Fedora folks. First question: Do I have the picture right? Is there a constituency for removing focus-follows-mouse at the Fedora level? What is the interface with the gnome developers? What is the background behind the decision?

It seems that the control-center-extra package the adds the focus-follows-mouse control is not on the F12 DVD ISO and must be installed by yum after one is up and running. At least I don't see it in /Packages. Second question: What was the thinking behind not including it on the distribution so that it could be installed initially as an option? There are systems not on the net. I would at least like to see this included in the installation packages so that non-network connected systems can be properly configured.

Finally, discussion. For those of us old Unix folks who can't imagine retraining the focus instincts after all these years, how can we best influence either the gnome level or the Fedora level to retain this (obviously superior) focus behaviour? Or do we all have to switch to the one true Windows way of doing things? I understand that others want the Windows style behaviour. I understand that the other mode might well be the best default choice for the Windows folks switching to Fedora. I even understand that there are some technical issues with implementing focus-follows-mouse in all the odd corners. However, it is a problem to have widely used technology just disappear without some very good reasons. What are the reasons? and what can we do to influence the retention of this mode of operation?

[RahulSundaram]

Hi,

My understanding is that upstream GNOME wants to drop this feature entirely and within Fedora, the desktop team has used this extra subpackage as a compromise. If you want to talk to them about this, post to

https://www.redhat.com/mailman/listinfo/fedora-desktop-list

Release engineering is responsible for the DVD image and it is only composed of default packages in various groups. What is optional in those package groups are left out.

[burnie]

I personally find focus follows mouse to be very desirable. Moving back and forth between two windows to copy and paste or to calculate and execute (whatever) requires two fewer mouse clicks per operation.

I'm also disappointed that I found no serious warning about this substantial change in normal preferences. Maybe I didn't read the release notes carefully enough.

And I'm even more seriously disappointed that, having yum installed control-center-extra, I'm still unable to find where to enable this desired behavior. It's not in window preferences, and there's no man page for control-center-extras. Running gconftool doesn't strike me as reasonable (plus it hasn't change since I installed control-center-extras), etc etc etc.

It seems pretty unreasonable (unlikely, even) that such a simple change would require a reboot; but that's where I'm headed now.

[colin-adams]

I personally find focus follows mouse to be very desirable. Moving back and forth between two windows to copy and paste or to calculate and execute (whatever) requires two fewer mouse clicks per operation.

I'm also disappointed that I found no serious warning about this substantial change in normal preferences. Maybe I didn't read the release notes carefully enough.

And I'm even more seriously disappointed that, having yum installed control-center-extra, I'm still unable to find where to enable this desired behavior. It's not in window preferences, and there's no man page for control-center-extras. Running gconftool doesn't strike me as reasonable (plus it hasn't change since I installed control-center-extras), etc etc etc.

It seems pretty unreasonable (unlikely, even) that such a simple change would require a reboot; but that's where I'm headed now.

I agree - focus follows mouse is a necessity for me.

[Crayz9000]

To re-enable focus follows mouse, run this command:

gconf-editor /apps/metacity/general/focus_mode
and change the focus_mode variable to "sloppy".

While this is a workaround, there is really no forgiving the GNOME devs for removing a commonly used option with very little warning. Then again, it's not the first time they've done this.

[Demz]

My suggestion is to switch to KDE thats what i'll probably be doing once F14 comes out. i aint gonna bother to much with F13

[dd_wizard]

Actually, just switch to openbox. Focus-follows-mouse is fully configurable in the Openbox Configuration Manager. I like the window shading and themes in openbox better than metacity, anyway.

dd_wizard

[Demz]

Metacity is very old an i think will not be in Gnome3?

[jd50]

Just another vote to bring back this feature. I've been using KDE for a little over a year now and am trying out GNOME again with a fresh F13 alpha install. I really don't understand why they would want to remove this feature.

[luminarycrush]

Yeah, this has only been a standard UNIX feature since.. oh, I don't know, SunOS 4 days (at least that's when I jumped on the UNIX train).

What's with the constant trend to not only dumb standard features down to the Windows level, but *force* the real users of these systems (eg tech-savy) to be dumbed-down also?

If they want to make it default so my grandmother (who will never use Linux anyway) will not get lost due to her Windows bias, so be it. But don't force me into that box.

Pretty soon they'll take out 'highlight = copy to clipboard'.

[uhmgawa]

To re-enable focus follows mouse, run this command:

gconf-editor /apps/metacity/general/focus_mode
and change the focus_mode variable to "sloppy".

While this is a workaround, there is really no forgiving the GNOME devs for removing a commonly used option with very little warning. Then again, it's not the first time they've done this.

Bless you.

But it shouldn't be this difficult -- really. I cannot for the life of me
understand WHY a feature so germane to the use of many would
be removed as a FREAKIN' optional feature.

But you're right it isn't the first time.. Somewhere around 5+/- years
ago the ability to push down a window was removed without warning
from the gnome regents. I switched back to fvwm (which I actually
perfer over gnome). I barely tolerate gnome foisted upon me with
each fedora install now that 3GHz processors and 4-8GB of memory
is common enough even in a entry level MalWart PC.

Gnome was an interesting body of work around the turn of the
century. Not so much afterwards..

[jd50]

Try

yum install control-center-extra

Then go to system -> preferences -> windows

[stevea]

Gnome was an interesting body of work around the turn of the
century. Not so much afterwards..

Then why don't they do what other projects do when they run out of intellectual steam - pull over to the side of the road, and putter around with security patches and minor feature revisions ? Instead they are taking over whole new domains of activity and snipping out perfectly functional "options".

Perhaps they could try repairing 'gdm' (which they broke several years ago, and hasn't worked since) before they re-invent the OS at the per-user desktop.

Some interesting things to do with gnome(s).
http://www.bifrost.com.au/hosting/gnomes/