Debating on Installing Aphla

[kanazky]

Hey,
I just downloaded the alpha CD, and after reading around here, I am worried about installing the Alpha, Has anyone had a smooth sailing yet on it? I mind you I wont use it for much more then eclipse.

[glennzo]

Why not wait until next Tuesday and get the Beta?

[LordMorgul]

Yep I would really recommend waiting for the Beta, or doing network install right now, but do not install from Alpha DVD and then update, its just not advantageous for you to do that.

[kanazky]

Wont it update itself to beta?

[kanazky]

Reason I ask is because I am using Ubuntu for a long time now, and the eclipse doesn't properly work.

[LordMorgul]

yes it will update itself to beta, however there are sometimes bugs in the alpha that can effect how the machine works when updated to beta. I'm not aware of any crippling bugs in alpha like that but so close to the beta release it makes better sense to just wait for that, or network install the beta right now (basically the mirrors already have beta available just not in image format).

[SlowJet]

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Test_Days/2008-09-25

Beta Testing is going on now (for 686 32 and 64).
There are many versions that need testing
FirstAidKit
USB install

SJ

[kanazky]

So hold on SlowJet, If I download that and install it im using the Beta?

[SlowJet]

You can read as good as I can.

SJ

[LordMorgul]

So hold on SlowJet, If I download that and install it im using the Beta?
No but you are using what is probably going to become the beta; in other words yes its the same set of packages intended to be released, but it might not be exactly what shows up on release if they find they need to change the installer image. It would be much better for you to use that than installing Alpha though.

[joe74]

I ran F10 LiveCD Alpha... it took a hell to finally load the desktop, and before that, a message complaining about the kernel showed up... It runs slow, quite slow. I didn't get to make it boot in VirtualBox 1.6

[ryptyde]

I ran F10 LiveCD Alpha... it took a hell to finally load the desktop, and before that, a message complaining about the kernel showed up... It runs slow, quite slow. I didn't get to make it boot in VirtualBox 1.6

LiveCD's definitely run slow but if you can install them to a usb stick with a persistent overlay they really shine. The only LiveCD's that have any speed are the small ones like DSL, Puppy or Austrumi. I'm quite happy running the Fedora livecd's from usb. :)

[OralDeckard]

So where can I find the prerelease F10 Beta boot.iso ?
I'm sure its obvious to everyone else, but not to me.

[joe74]

So where can I find the prerelease F10 Beta boot.iso ?
I'm sure its obvious to everyone else, but not to me.

ok... Have fun!

dvd... http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/test/10-Alpha/Fedora/i386/iso/Fedora-10-Alpha-i386-DVD.iso

live cd gnome...http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/test/10-Alpha/Live/i686/Fedora-10-Alpha-i686-Live.iso

kde... ummh...live cd... http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/test/10-Alpha/Live/i686/Fedora-10-Alpha-i686-Live-KDE.iso

Gut nite!

[Demz]

So where can I find the prerelease F10 Beta boot.iso ?
I'm sure its obvious to everyone else, but not to me.
the beta will be out on the 30th,, dont waste your time downloading the Alpha

[OralDeckard]

Thank you Joe. But none of these were a boot.iso, and they were all Alphas.
What am I missing here ?

[Demz]

Thank you Joe. But none of these were a boot.iso, and they were all Alphas.
What am I missing here ?
as i stated, do not worry aboiut the Alpha.. th beta will be released in 2 days time

[OralDeckard]

Right, Demz, I couldn't agree more. But earlier LordMorgul said "or network install the beta right now (basically the mirrors already have beta available just not in image format)."

And thats what I want to do. Downloading 800 MB of Alpha instead of a boot.iso for Beta makes no sense to me. Can you direct me to the network install for Beta ?

[Demz]

IMO thats still wasting a download,,, again its best to do a clean install of a test release than having crap from an Alpha left behind .i dont know where the network install is..my guess is i would look on the download Mirrors on http://fedoraproject.org

[OralDeckard]

Welll its not there. In the earlier discussion it was described as being not crap from Alpha, but the Beta code intended for release on Tuesday, with the understanding that it could change if something awful is discovered before Tuesday.

I don't want an Alpha, but am quite willing to take a chance on the Beta as it is intended to be released, with the caveat. My problem is that my connection speed is not great. If I start now I may finish my install by Wednesday. If I start on Tuesday, when everyone else is hitting the servers, it will be even worse.

[Demz]

well i do know that they have changed stuff in Anaconda, whether that would effect it or not i dont know ..to be on the safe side i'd just wait for the Beta release or hang around the forums on the 29th late an watch to see if someone post's a leak,

[joe74]

oh, my friend... that'll give us time to read whatever may come from the beta...

[wvn]

So i am not the only one who secretely things that best thing after beer is doing a clean install (Oh formatting)

:)

[OralDeckard]

I found it here:
http://fedora.c3sl.ufpr.br/linux/development/i386/os/images/

It is 117.2 MB, and has only 5 hours to go :)

[Demz]

good find :).. let us know how it goes

[OralDeckard]

Actually it went badly. It downloaded 3.2 MB and declared itself DONE.
So I tried again, and left it downloading and went to bed, thinking I would get up and find it done.
And again it got 3.2 MB and declared itself done.

So I downloaded it at work in an hour and a half and got it all.

Now to install it in a VM. I haven't done it this way before, so hope all goes smoothly.
VMs are great. If it doesn't install I am not wrestling with a non-bootable piece of hardware. I just delete the VM's folder and try again :)

[OralDeckard]

Well it now has 376 packages downloaded, so all I have to do is wait.

My thinking is that how much they change from the day before the release won't be that much more than what they will change one day after the release. And being the Beta I should get those changes with my first update.

As I recall, even after the official release there are so many updates every day that getting started one day early isn't going to be significantly worse.

And the Anaconda part went just fine.

[LordMorgul]

The anaconda on the current boot.iso should be the same as Beta will get anyway, due to the devel freeze. However, its not guaranteed since they could have changed anaconda just last night to build the images if necessary. As of today, it had better be the latest anaconda or the release would have been delayed. Anyway, you should be up and running fine after the freeze lifts and updates go out.

[OralDeckard]

Greetings Lord Morgul.
My, that name sounds ominous :|

Anyway, thanks for the heads up that I could get as a boot.iso. I have it installed and am posting from it.

First impressions: F9 on downers. KDE locked up during boot repeatedly, and slooooooooooow before the final lockup at the same point. Fortunately I also selected gnome during installation, as I always do, and gnome is better than it has ever been. I like it.

Second impression: I must have entered a root password during installation that was different from what I though it was, and am locked out until I boot into run level two. I had a little trouble installing the vmware tools, so I tried to switch to the root account. It would not accept my password.

Then back in my user account I decided to check one more time by modifying my firewall. It took the root password just fine. Maybe I should file a bug zilla.

There are two Dolphins, one that is underpowered and one that is fine. So I'll use the one that is fine.

I was very disappointed with KDE4 in F9 and am still using F8 for flawless functionality. I have great hopes for F10. Even as a Beta it is better than F9, even though it has the same look and feel.

Well, I won't get to use this again until after work tomorrow, so by then I will learn how you all loved or hated it. But with Gnome working this well as a Beta, I think I am going to finally switch from F8.

[OralDeckard]

Well anyway, in case you wanted to know, I was able to su into root and install vmware tools with rpm -ivh. My root password was accepted. But when trying to log on as root, my root password is not accepted. No biggie since seldom feel the urge to log on as root. But I think I'll file a bugzilla on it.

And I might as well gig that poor showing from KDE, and the two Dolphins, one good and one bad, and the two System Monitors, one that works fine and one that doesn't work at all.

On F9 I bugzilla's the File Manager Super User Mode that wasn't, and they never did get it fixed, even when I told them how. Just a little script providing SU in front of Konqueror should have done the trick. Owe well. Onward and upward.

[LordMorgul]

Greetings Lord Morgul.
My, that name sounds ominous :|

Lord of the Rings reference (I'm a huge fan), the Lord of Minas Morgul is the first among the Nine Ring Wraiths, the Witch-King of Angmar (once a 'king of kings' so to speak). Yeah its supposed to be a bit ominous I guess. :-)

Second impression: I must have entered a root password during installation that was different from what I though it was, and am locked out until I boot into run level two. I had a little trouble installing the vmware tools, so I tried to switch to the root account. It would not accept my password.

Then back in my user account I decided to check one more time by modifying my firewall. It took the root password just fine. Maybe I should file a bug zilla.

This is intentional if you were trying to login graphically as root (from GDM). Its configured to deny that login as a security precaution; you can change that if you like although I don't know the syntax for configuring it (never had a reason to).

There are two Dolphins, one that is underpowered and one that is fine. So I'll use the one that is fine.

I was very disappointed with KDE4 in F9 and am still using F8 for flawless functionality. I have great hopes for F10. Even as a Beta it is better than F9, even though it has the same look and feel.

Well, I won't get to use this again until after work tomorrow, so by then I will learn how you all loved or hated it. But with Gnome working this well as a Beta, I think I am going to finally switch from F8.
I pretty much agree with all that, its a slight improvement over F9 with minor features, mostly features that were not quite finished for F9. F11 (I hear) is supposed to be a much fuller feature release.

[Demz]

any ideas if KDE4.2.0 will get into fedora11?

[OralDeckard]

Ah, so I'm communicating with a ring wraith :O I read that series in 1970.

Well you will start your downloads in a few minutes, so further impressions are already stale. But an observation. When I went to Yumex I found that 339 updates were ready :O Really ? I expected maybe a half dozen. I expect the number to rise sharply right after it gets downloaded and people try it out, but 339 seemed a little high for something about to be released the next day.

And yes, I think disallowing a root login at the greeter is a good security feature, and don't plan to turn it off.

And one last observation. It seems very slow. I know it is a Beta and am hoping it will speed up. But F9 was slow too. I run F8 VMs right next to it and they are snappy. But F9 and F10 Beta are like walking in sand. Maybe it is the eye candy desktop and I can get speed back by trying XFCE or something. Or maybe just wait for the final release.

[LordMorgul]

@Demz, I have no idea on KDE 4.2.0 I haven't seen any discussion on it.

@OralDeckard, yes the high number of updates is pretty normal for Alpha and Beta release because the Development Freeze stops package changes from getting into the Release images... but does not stop the developers from continuing from changing and fixing the packages. The harder they keep working during that freeze the more updates you'll see; it does not mean there were that many known bugs to fix necessarily, its just 'changes' in general, could be bugs could be improvements, etc, during the freeze.

About speed, it IS slow, thats not just your impression; the reason is because during development all the debugging and extra logging features are turned on (including some kernel level stuff that REALLY slows things down). It will be significantly faster after official release. As for F9 being slower as well, yeah its probably feature bloat having some effect, especially with virtual machine installs you see that start to really impact performance (I use VMs alot for linux on my macbook).

[OralDeckard]

Thank you LordMorgul. I knew about the debug features being turned on and naturally having an effect on speed. But F9 ran slow, AFTER release, on a native installaion on a Phenom with 4 gig of ram. And it plodded in a VM on my dual core Athlon 3500 next to my F8 VM than ran fast. So that is why I am watching so close on the speed issue. But you're right, I need to wait for the release to judge its speed.

VMs do pretty good. I run Autocad in a VM on my F8 host.