Why my Fedora experience is so unsatisfying

[Reisswolf]

Since every guy and his brother and first cousin twice removed have been starting such threads, I figured I should as well--just to go with the flow.

*****

It goes without saying that a good operating system should provide its users with a satisfying computing experience. But real satisfaction comes from the surmounting of real challenges--and therein lies the real shortcoming of Fedora. It simply does not provide me with the challenges I need for a fulfilling experience.

My dissatisfaction goes all the way back to the downloading of the Fedora 7 x86_64 DVD image. I encountered a small error, but that was readily fixed. Then, after I had burnt the image on to a DVD, I was ready to install the new system. During none of these steps did I encounter a real problem, a real challenge, whose resolution would have brought me real satisfaction.

Before beginning the installation I had every reason to be optimistic about facing real challenges. I had read in a couple of threads at this forum that the x86_64 version of the DVD image was problematic. So I placed the DVD in the tray, restarted my computer and sat expectantly, hoping that sooner or later a problem would require my deepest attention and utmost Linux resourcefulness. Instead, the installation finished without a hitch, and I was left shaking my head in disbelief at my ill fortune. Once again, I had been denied the challenges that I, as a Fedora user, deserve. Once again, I had been denied the opportunity for fist-pumping and the general triumphalism of those who have successfully overcome problems during installation.

The monitor was configured properly. The video card was detected correctly, as was the sound card. All the software was installed correctly. Yum was configured correctly, and after I had imported the key, the system update was done correctly, at a reasonable speed too. At no stage did the process require any real intervention from me.

All the familiar software was once again ready for use. There were KDevelop, Kate, Quanta and Glade 2, lying in solemn repose inside their menus, prepared to spring into action at any time. There were the games, looking sheepishly at me, inviting me to engage them and waste precious time. The office programmes had the good manners not to obtrude themselves this time, having chosen to stay away from the task bar. The personalisation of the desktop was done with a minimum of fuss: Keltern wallpaper, Phacile Metacity windows and Phacile GTK+ controls were once again put in place, The exact set-up was also accomplished in KDE (DeKorator has a Phacile theme) and I felt right at home.

A few unnecessary services were enabled by default. But after I had turned them off with chkconfig, the boot-up time was reduced dramatically. The system is now very fast and responsive.

This arrant disregard of my thrill-seeking by Fedora 7 has compelled me to look for challenges elsewhere. I have decided that I am going to install a different operating system--in order that my current boredom will not cause me to have affairs and start cheating on my girlfriend.

If you are still reading, thank you for your time. I beg your indulgence and understanding. Perhaps in a few years Fedora will have developed to the point where it will be satisfying for me to use. Until then, goodbye!

[Wayne]

I quite understand your frustration. It's a real pain when everything "just works" :D

Thanks for the grin before I head out on my beer-run!

Wayne

[leigh123linux]

If you want a little excitement try sidux it is cutting edge like fedora but more buggy ( there are things to fix :cool: )

http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=sidux

[pete_1967]

Go back to Ubuntu then!

[leadgolem]

Try setting up java/flash plugins in the 64bit version, and still have azureus installed.:) That should give you a few minutes of head scratching.

[Dan]

Hmmm.

You obviously didn't use a strong enough password! Either that, or you actually wrote it down ... correctly.

For shame, man! <..:p..>


Dan

[JN4OldSchool]

Hey, no one noticed but that was one of the most eloquent posts I have read yet! That was beautiful man, good choice of wording in there.

"All the familiar software was once again ready for use. There were KDevelop, Kate, Quanta and Glade 2, lying in solemn repose inside their menus, prepared to spring into action at any time. There were the games, looking sheepishly at me, inviting me to engage them and waste precious time. The office programmes had the good manners not to obtrude themselves this time, having chosen to stay away from the task bar. The personalisation of the desktop was done with a minimum of fuss: Keltern wallpaper, Phacile Metacity windows and Phacile GTK+ controls were once again put in place, The exact set-up was also accomplished in KDE (DeKorator has a Phacile theme) and I felt right at home."

That is sheer poetry man! This piece should be published somewhere. Thanks for the great read.

[kr4ey]

Yes am am Unsatisfyed too!!!
Although Fedora 7 has allot of improvements there are quite allot of things missing.

NO Kernel Source
NO K3B Software

I did not have it installed very long (maybe 15 minutes) I'm sure there is probably more.

No way to compile anything without the kernel source, so it was a waste of time even installing it.
And when I have only Dial-Up It's useless.

Do they really need to leave so much very important packages out of there distro...it's not they ran
out of room on the DVD!!!

[leigh123linux]

Yes am am Unsatisfyed too!!!
Although Fedora 7 has allot of improvements there are quite allot of things missing.

NO Kernel Source
NO K3B Software

I did not have it installed very long (maybe 15 minutes) I'm sure there is probably more.

No way to compile anything without the kernel source, so it was a waste of time even installing it.
And when I have only Dial-Up It's useless.

Do they really need to leave so much very important packages out of there distro...it's not they ran
out of room on the DVD!!!

You don't need a kernel source as this is provided by the kernel-devel ( its on the DVD ).

K3b is in the Fedora repo

su
yum install k3b


Perhaps you should sod of back to Windoze :rolleyes:

[JN4OldSchool]

or just sod off period. Fedora doesnt need you...at all...

[bob]

Ummm...people? The guy likes a KDE app (k3b) and doesn't know what the kernel source is contained by and expresses himself and we take this attitude? C'mon now. It's not a personal attack, he just got ticked by the distro. and didn't take the time to ask about. He's off to something else now, let's wish him well.

[JN4OldSchool]

I'm sorry Bob, but the guy wants to come across like some kind of expert but obviously knows nothing at all. He is the on ly source of his frustration. If he wants the kernel source then he can simply install it like K3b. K3b is also on the DVD so it is all a moot point and nothing but a lame attempt at a troll. Besides, he only had it all of 15 minutes anyway, I seriously doubt he could compile anything if his life depended on it...But you are right, I will simply wish him luck wherever the wind may blow him...

[leigh123linux]

Ummm...people? The guy likes a KDE app (k3b) and doesn't know what the kernel source is contained by and expresses himself and we take this attitude? C'mon now. It's not a personal attack, he just got ticked by the distro. and didn't take the time to ask about. He's off to something else now, let's wish him well.

Well I,m not sorry , perhaps if he had posted and asked for help instead of blaming Fedora for having bits missing.

He's off to something else now,

Yeh hopefully Windoze :p

[kr4ey]

Perhaps you should sod of back to Windoze :rolleyes:

NO. I no longer use or have Windoze.
Yes. I was off to do something else, but I know it was not using Windoze.

I have migrated all my computers to Linux 5 years ago.

[leigh123linux]

NO. I no longer use or have Windoze.
Yes. I was off to do something else, but I know it was not using Windoze.

I have migrated all my computers to Linux 5 years ago.

Just ask if you have any problems with Fedora !!

[bob]

Kr4ey, you may have misjudged the contents on the DVD a bit, but if you didn't like it, you didn't like it. Fair enough. I'm certainly not suggesting you install it again to make a point, since there are hundreds of other distros out there and not every one appeals to every user, but it's always a good policy to ask a few questions before assuming you have the answers. That said, enjoy whatever distros fit your needs and good luck to you.

[leigh123linux]

NO. I no longer use or have Windoze.
Yes. I was off to do something else, but I know it was not using Windoze.

I have migrated all my computers to Linux 5 years ago.

You might find this useful.

Using the DVD as a yum repo.

1. Loop mount the image. ( use a iso image )

mkdir /path/to/mount/point
mount -t iso9660 -o loop /path/to/image.iso /path/to/mount/point

2. Add the local repository definition to your target. ( /etc/yum.repos.d/loop.repo )

[fedora-local]
name=Fedora 7 - Moonshine - i386 - Loop Mounted ISO Image
baseurl=file:///path/to/mount/point/
enabled=1
gpgcheck=1

3. If you need to build a kernel module you will need these tools.

yum groupinstall "Development Tools"
yum install kernel-devel

[herrib]

Reisswolf,

Your testimony had been translated and posted far away from your homeland, in the wide space of foreign users forum: http://forums.fedora-fr.org/viewtopic.php?pid=175523#p175523

Therefore, the old Europe will sooner or later be obviously aware of your great disappointment whereas you'll certainly pursue new politics to get excited.

[kr4ey]

Kr4ey, you may have misjudged the contents on the DVD a bit, but if you didn't like it, you didn't like it. Fair enough. I'm certainly not suggesting you install it again to make a point, since there are hundreds of other distros out there and not every one appeals to every user, but it's always a good policy to ask a few questions before assuming you have the answers. That said, enjoy whatever distros fit your needs and good luck to you.

Thank you. I also found when I had Fedora 7 installed it was rather buggy also (apps not shutting down, and terminate box popping up).


Quote: If you need to build a kernel module you will need these tools.

Quote:
yum groupinstall "Development Tools"
yum install kernel-devel

That would be nice but I have Dialup and I can't install it if I don't have kernel-devel in the first place to compile my modem package.

Nobody has all the answers, they think they do, on forums everybody has there own input.
That being said, in my opinion Fedora 7 needs allot of work and should have never been released, it's to buggy. And they should seriously review what packages are included on there DVD.

[leigh123linux]

Thank you. I also found when I had Fedora 7 installed it was rather buggy also (apps not shutting down, and terminate box popping up).


Quote: If you need to build a kernel module you will need these tools.

Quote:
yum groupinstall "Development Tools"
yum install kernel-devel

That would be nice but I have Dialup and I can't install it if I don't have kernel-devel in the first place to compile my modem package.

Nobody has all the answers, they think they do, on forums everybody has there own input.
That being said, in my opinion Fedora 7 needs allot of work and should have never been released, it's to buggy. And they should seriously review what packages are included on there DVD.


Points 1 & 2 would have enabled you to use the dvd image a repo thus enabling point 3

Fedora is cutting edge and needs to be updated after install to fix the release bugs.

And they should seriously review what packages are included on there DVD

Everything you need is there on the DVD ( kernel-devel + tools , you may have to fecth some packages manually from the livna repo for wireless )

[bob]

Kr4ey, with your problems and dial-up, it's not the distro for you. Good luck elsewhere.

[JN4OldSchool]

uh, why did you just not install kernel devel and K3b when you installed? You are going to have this same problem with any distro? Fedora is no different than anything else and if you have been using Linux for five years you should realize this. Linux is Linux. Fedora isnt buggy for me, it works great. Havent had any problems yet. In fact, Reisswolf is right, it is getting boring these days. Bob, ever the diplomat, is right here. You are just trying to pick a fight in a biker bar in this forum. We arent developers, we are just users who love Fedora. If you dont like it then just move along, your input here isnt doing anything constructive. As Bob said, there are many fine distros. Why waste your time with this?

[Reisswolf]

Ha ha ha! Herrib, I can't believe you have actually taken the trouble to translate it!

But thank you very much indeed! If my silliness can bring a grin to someone's face, I will be happy.

[kr4ey]

You are going to have this same problem with any distro?

No I am not. I can have ALL my hardware on my notebook configured including the internal modem 15 minutes after an install with my other distros i use, I don't have to connected to the internet and I don't get dependency hell.
But now I will go away and leave all you Fedoraians to this godforsaken place you call a forum.

Like I tell everyone else trying to get a internal modem to work with Fedora, Don't waste your time.

[JN4OldSchool]

lol, dont slam the...<BAM>...door...

[Dies]

<...late to the party...>

Hmm, what was that all about ?


:D

[JN4OldSchool]

<...late to the party...>

Hmm, what was that all about ?


:D

another...<sob>...satisfied....<gasp>......customer.....

At this rate I will NEVER make any money off Fedora....

<WAAAAAAA>

[Wayne]

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz zzzzzzzzz


Wayne

[bob]

Oh fine! Now he's off to spread the word to Winmodem lovers everywhere. :eek: Worse yet, I've got to hang around this "godforsaken place you call a Forum" with all you Fedoraians. :( Hmmm...time for a beer... :) :) :)

[w5set]

Well, if 3:30pm was beer time--then now it's beer thirty and past time...umm?
When I used to HAVE to use a dial up modem, I felt lucky at the time to even have internet access.
Now I use DSL and feel rather peed off when it only does 780K down...
I do remember when downloading OO it took over one day with dialup back several years ago ....having dialup as a only way to get stuff sucks, folks.
Guess he really just wanted to vent a bit of frustration.....as we all do from time to time.
Hope he finds a solution in one distro or another.
(but they WERE available in the install DVD for him to install)

[JN4OldSchool]

well, the initial tirade I can understand, though passing yourself off as superpowertux when you cant even figure out the anaconda installer is never advised...But when more than one person tried to explain to him he was mistaken he could have listened instead of continuing to whine. But then I guess that would have just took the fire out of his flame and that isnt good...

[Dan]

Oh fine! Now he's off to spread the word to Winmodem lovers everywhere. :eek: Worse yet, I've got to hang around this "godforsaken place you call a Forum" with all you Fedoraians. :( Hmmm...time for a beer... :) :) :) Ahhh, Bob. That white hat can get heavy, can't it? They say it's lonely at the top. Might as well make that two beers. <..:p..>


Dan

[Adesso]

Viva the resistance.. to get back to the original poetic post.. Great read.. pity that some bafoon spoils it with k3b bull...

Nerving how so much of these so called experts just pop up huh.. Just for my 2cents then on the kr4ey remark.. go back to Suse if Fedora is not satisfying enough, and get swallowed up all over by Novell and Microsoft...

[QuantumKnot]

K3b is also on the DVD so it is all a moot point ...

hmm....K3b is not on the F7 DVD (at least not on mine, I don't see the package anywhere on it).

[stephanie.steve]

yay, that was a head scratcher ;) your rite :X k3b isn't on there but* under dvd+rw-tools I think it is? :) not 100% sure X: I have that installed and when trying to remove it it also wants to remove k3b.. so I think it's under that? sometimes they will bundle stuff under thing's like this like kde multimedia rpm package or whatever it was :X that's how I knew ;) hope I'm rite :X

[JN4OldSchool]

hmm....K3b is not on the F7 DVD (at least not on mine, I don't see the package anywhere on it).

:confused: Sure enough. It is nowhere in the customize install option of Pirut. :mad: Of course for 99.999% of us this is no big deal, just DL it after the install. But for those who wont have an internet connection this is a valid point. The flip side of that though is, though it is pure opinion, I dont feel that anyone that does not have an internet connection has any business using Fedora anyway. But I concede the point. :)

[QuantumKnot]

:confused: Sure enough. It is nowhere in the customize install option of Pirut. :mad: Of course for 99.999% of us this is no big deal, just DL it after the install. But for those who wont have an internet connection this is a valid point. The flip side of that though is, though it is pure opinion, I dont feel that anyone that does not have an internet connection has any business using Fedora anyway. But I concede the point. :)

That's cool. I wasn't really trying to prove the point but was just curious since k3b was missing during my first install of F7 so I thought I may have overlooked it during the customization stage.

Personally, it would've been more convenient for it to be on the DVD. I mean, it makes sense to remove some stuff to keep the DVD iso small (at least less than 4.6 GB to fit on an actual DVD-R), but IIRC, the ISO is only 2.8 GB, so that extra 20 MB or so for k3b would've been manageable, I think ;)

[stephanie.steve]

is it not under dvd+rw-tools ?

[QuantumKnot]

is it not under dvd+rw-tools ?

I checked the dvd+rw-tools package. It is too small to contain k3b. I think k3b depends on it, so if you uninstalled dvd+rw-tools, it removes k3b as well.

[stephanie.steve]

ah, well dang :X still trying to get the hang of some of this stuff ;) guess it's kind of like taking a required dll out so it just may as well remove the program

[JN4OldSchool]

yep. I just had a further thought. I spent all that time setting up the install in vmware when I JUST did a complete install of Fedora 7 on my server. I initially did a very stripped down install but decided I was NOT going to update this install at all so I thought what the heck and re-installed using EVERYTHING on the DVD just to check it out. Well, long story short, I just checked that computer and K3b is NOT on there. So it wasnt hidden in any other packages. It was just omitted and I agree that that is a very stupid choice considering the amount of crap that IS included in the ISO. But...I suppose everyone has his opinion...

[FriedChips]

Well ( back to the OP ) if you need a better challenge try installing the fedora 8 test 2, actually better yet give this a shot.

su -
yum update --enablerepo=development --enablerepo=livna-development

that should keep you busy for a while
if that seems fun just enable the repo for good and have at it bro!

edit: changed fedora 7 test 2 to fedora 8 test 2 :rolleyes:

[stephanie.steve]

how about "fedora 8" test 2? :)

[FriedChips]

how about "fedora 8" test 2? :)

Right that's what I meant ;) :cool:

[stephanie.steve]

I have yet to start testing fedora :X maybe I should :D after all that's what vmware is for.. messing thing's up on a massive level*! mwhahaha.. first login as root and remove something :0 I tried that once and little did I know it would mess up almost every single piece of software and yum and if I remember correctly the terminal as well.. oh yes that was b e a utifull*!

[sircave1]

:confused: Sure enough. It is nowhere in the customize install option of Pirut. :mad: Of course for 99.999% of us this is no big deal, just DL it after the install. But for those who wont have an internet connection this is a valid point. The flip side of that though is, though it is pure opinion, I dont feel that anyone that does not have an internet connection has any business using Fedora anyway. But I concede the point. :)


I have a question and a comment to make.

1. I am borrowing a wireless connection from where I live, using only a wireless usb adapter to connect to the internet, not having dial-up, cable or dsl. I take my rig over to my brother-law's house to update Fedora when I move up on that distro. I am trying to like & learn about this distro, so I go through exhausting lengths to use it. I was wondering what distro would be good for people without a real connection to the net? :confused:

2. The article that started this thread was beautiful. Very articulate and humorous. I got a good laugh from it. My Fedora hat is off to the poster. :cool:

[FriedChips]

My Fedora hat is off to the poster. :cool:

You do know that Fedora means hat? kind of a pun I guess.

[JN4OldSchool]

I have a question and a comment to make.

1. I am borrowing a wireless connection from where I live, using only a wireless usb adapter to connect to the internet, not having dial-up, cable or dsl. I take my rig over to my brother-law's house to update Fedora when I move up on that distro. I am trying to like & learn about this distro, so I go through exhausting lengths to use it. I was wondering what distro would be good for people without a real connection to the net? :confused:

2. The article that started this thread was beautiful. Very articulate and humorous. I got a good laugh from it. My Fedora hat is off to the poster. :cool:

Welllllll...My reasoning behind Fedora is that it is a very fast paced cutting edge distro. Most people use it because they like to be on the cutting edge, with the latest and greatest stuff. Also consider that Fedora runs the same version apps most other distros run, it is just that Fedora updates it's base OS on a constant basis. I mean like 30-100MB every couple days for an average install. Now...this does NOT mean you have to accept these updates. You could just accept security updates. I just switched my server back to Fedora from debian etch for purposes of unity. I will NEVER run a yum update on this, I am using the kernel that came with the iso. So take my comment with a grain of salt. It is all Linux and you can do what you want. I am quoted many times as saying I wouldnt recommend Fedora for a server and here I am using it as such. :rolleyes:

What would I recommend in your case? Debian etch will hardly ever update. It is stable and undemanding and mainstream linux. It is also as boring as watching paint dry. I have found Ubuntu updates durn near as much as Fedora. Everyone loves PCLinuxOS and all it's variants like SAM. I am not crazy about PCLinuxOS...But it is a good distro. I prefer Mepis. Zenwalk was good. I guess what I am trying to say is only you can answer this. Maybe Fedora is for you? Maybe you just like the look and feel and a couple hundred MB update every few weeks when you can get over B-in-law's house is no sweat. Just be aware that Fedora is a very busy group of developers. :)

[sircave1]

To be honest about it, my flavor is Gentoo. I loved pulling my hair out and tinkering with my system and I absolutely love the idea of being able to configure my own system from scratch. As I stated in my earlier post, my circumstances leave me little to no choice on what system to use if I don't need internet access, which of course I do. So of course I want the most current, stable system possible which means dragging my rig back and forth for now. As long as he does not get tired of me asking.....


Anyway, I like the look of Fedora right now, but as soon as I am able, I will probably switch over to Gentoo once I get into a real place and get DSL or a cable connection. I do appreciate your response.

P.S. I don't update as often as the updates come out. I was dual booting Microsuck on this machine when I read a post that stated: What is the point of dual booting if you have two computers? One should be completely linux. I thought about that point and decided to cancel the dual boot, make the machine completely linux and eventually migrate over to that OS. I was concerned about my games but hell, I have Xbox, PS2 and SNES to keep me busy.

Thx a lot.

[JN4OldSchool]

I was dual booting Microsuck on this machine when I read a post that stated: What is the point of dual booting if you have two computers? One should be completely linux. I thought about that point and decided to cancel the dual boot, make the machine completely linux and eventually migrate over to that OS.

Kind of out of context to what you are saying (I dont even have Windows anymore 'cept for the wife's Vista laptop which is a work requirement :( ) but I have at LEAST two operating systems on ALL of my computers. The reason? A backdoor. This way if anything happens the computer doesnt go down. I also have shared partitions on each of the computers along with a networked backup partition. Now granted I could just use a live CD to get in if I ever had to, not to mention I have a stack of probably over 50 distro ISO CDs going back 5 years or more :D that could be installed in a jiff...but hey, it's my system and it is what works for me... :rolleyes:

[sircave1]

Thank you for your insights and thoughts. I am not mad at cha about the microsuck boxes. We all were there once upon a time and I am still there for the moment with one of my boxes. Vista is the way of some of the corporate world, so your wife has no choice.

[leigh123linux]

Thank you for your insights and thoughts. I am not mad at cha about the microsuck boxes. We all were there once upon a time and I am still there for the moment with one of my boxes. Vista is the way of some of the corporate world, so your wife has no choice.


Most of the corporate users wont touch Vista with a barge pole and prefer to use something more stable like Windows 2000 or XP .
The company I work for wont even consider Vista as a replacement till the first sevice pack is released and even than I think they will reject it in favor of windows 2008 server :cool: .

[kevmif]

If its all too easy for you, then you should be a developer and not just a user ;)

[heloOO]

I have a question and a comment to make.

1. I am borrowing a wireless connection from where I live, using only a wireless usb adapter to connect to the internet, not having dial-up, cable or dsl. I take my rig over to my brother-law's house to update Fedora when I move up on that distro. I am trying to like & learn about this distro, so I go through exhausting lengths to use it. I was wondering what distro would be good for people without a real connection to the net? :confused:


I guess your lengths are exhaustive if you compare ur Fedora experience with Windows, that's because Fedora's priorities tend to lean towards enterprise features, rather than desktop usability.
You should check this SITE (http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major) to find out what suits you

[FriedChips]

I guess your lengths are exhaustive if you compare ur Fedora experience with Windows, that's because Fedora's priorities tend to lean towards enterprise features, rather than desktop usability.
You should check this SITE (http://distrowatch.com/dwres.php?resource=major) to find out what suits you

That's a matter of opinion, Fedora makes a great desktop OS for me. I don't do anything "enterprise" I nuke newbs in Nexuiz, listen to music, watch dvd's, and post back to ppl like you.....

[Omnicloud]

Same here...right now I'm posting from Enlightement on Fedora 7...tomorrow I switch back to KDe or Gnome. and I love every second of it!!

I always download every Naruto episode that comes out, and I watch/download/burn everything on my Fedora desktop...

So yeah to each his own...After I get Debian on my PC as my backup...I'm good to go...

[SimplySickOfMS]

I wish Reisswolf taught my English class or at least hung around to write more good stuff about Fedora.

[armandocl]

hey all you guys dont look the bad sides of the things. Look the bright side linux its free hads a lot of sofware that is useful.

i personaly used fedora and windoz.

[Omnicloud]

hey all you guys dont look the bad sides of the things. Look the bright side linux its free hads a lot of sofware that is useful.

i personaly used fedora and windoz.I think the thread was full of mixed reactions man...

There's plenty of people who use Linux and linux only...

i'm fairly new to linux and Fedora is my only desktop at home.

So yeah, Linux=OWNAGE and of course it's free...on top of that, with a little work, it will do just about everything you need it too...